Posted by Jeff (24.30.53.181) on November 12, 2001 at 22:10:23:
In Reply to: sorry posted by campfire zero on November 12, 2001 at 09:57:08:
: Jeff -
: i, too, would like to see the MidEast someday... & yes, Ir@qi, i firmly believe that this "war" on Afghanistan is very similar to what happened to Iraq (where the US gov't used aerosolized LSD, among other things, to incapacitate the Iraqi troops - not that the US press would cover this - it came out in a South African newpaper, & i can't find that article anymore...) - it is quite obviously about oil, heroin, (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/ BBC news online had a host of articles this past spring/summer about Turkmenistani/Caspian Sea oil & how the US might try to access it... i'd put up links to these articles, only the server isn't responding right now) & now jewels (http://abcnews.go.com/sections/GMA/GoodMorningAmerica/GMA011106Afghani_Gem_dealer.html). what really sucks is that there is almost nothing anyone can do about this. we are all held hostage by those in our gov't who seek profit from antiquated ideologies (& not necessarily those ideologies that we, the citizens, are made to believe are those of our elected officials).
&&&&&**** Wow, I can't agree with you more. I was listening to NPR today and they were remembering the author of "One flew over the cuckoo's nest".. he was a student when he took part in the US government's tests... they gave him LSD. He was basically a lab rat, given drugs by the US government... and oil, oil, oil, oh man is Turkey going to be happy when the US starts pumping oil from them (more than they are now). The US is even considering normalizing relations with Azerbaijan because of Oil, and it's going to destablize the whole region when Azerbaijan and Turkey get into a war with Armenia since Russia, and Europe will be involved... so you have the US bombing the fuck out of Afghanistan, and another war in Europe....... and the "news" services giving us all propaganda. Did you know that the US got out of the "great depression" by making tanks and other instruments of war for the allies? They will use wars to get us out of our current economic situation... and the general population is none the wiser.
: what frustrates the hell out of me is Wolfowitz, Blitzer, & Fox News - those war mongers really want to extend this conflict to Iraq. the media keeps subtly pushing the stupid notion that this anthrax scare is due to Iraq. how much sense does this make? Iraq is & has been afraid of nuclear retaliation from the US - the US gov't made this threat seem real to Iraq during the Gulf War (& this is why the Iraqis themselves did not use chemical or biological warfare agents against US troops).
&&&&***** As sad as that is, it is true. I have noticed the same. They bring out the whole "weapons of mass destruction" cliche, it's all bullshit propaganda and everyone buys it.
: i am willing to bet that that anthrax hoax is due to some jerk with a lot of money in the US - it is not only an attempt to implicate Iraq, but it's also a direct attack on personal mail (one of the last remnants of privacy left for long distance communication - anything online or via phone can now be fully monitored legally). & no one stupid is behind this, or they'd have died of the anthrax themselves... no - it is someone with a lot of power, influence, &/or money (who is able to set this up, obtain materials, find the necessary quiet links) who is responsible for this. & i feel doubly sorry for the direct victims of this act in itself & the victims of the hype that has ensued.
&&&*** Wait, you can encrypt your e-mail, and you can anonymousely surf the web... yes, you can. I wonder, though, if it is as easy to break the encryption and/or if the "anonymous" web surfing is REALLY anonymous, or more propaganda?
: what does the US want from Iraq?
&&&**** I bet Fred would love to answer that question. Pancho, you reading this?
: not just its oil. Iraq was the center of civilization for centuries - it has an incredibly wealthy past (the greatness of Babylon). the British, German, US, possibly French, Turkish, & Russian gov'ts have been interested in this wealth, history, & power since at least the 1800's. the oil findings only hastened the activities of the US gov't, providing the US gov't with more allies (oil industry), more backing. the Gulf War was also a weapons testing ground - this was enthusiastically backed by the weapons industry.
: maybe i am full of idiot notions, but this is how i feel about this whole ordeal.
&&&&*** Stop this self-deprecating (sp?) notion that you are stupid! You are intelligent and reasonable.
: no, i can not & never will have a webpage - i'd rather lobby & talk to my friends & knowledgeable people (whom i trust - like you guys) about this. my dad works indirectly with the weapons industry; my mom, used to as well - she quit thanks to assholes (w/ essentially BS's in engineering) who didn't acknowledge her PhD in theoretical physics, & Masters in math - she had a lot of self-inflated egos to negotiate with all the time, making her very depressed. i love my mom. she's my hero - she sees through everyone, gives herself innocently & wholly to the things she loves, is the most humane individual i have ever met, & is incredibly brilliant in her field (who else does my dad consult for expert opinions?). she also quit b/c she thought DU weapons were a bad idea to make, & no one listened to her... anyway, i digress - the CIA & FBI monitor my dad & his family a lot, simply b/c he was born & raised in Iraq (never mind that he left the country in his late teens, well before Saddam came into power) & b/c of his work. i know my line is tapped. i know my family's lines are tapped. & i'm willing to bet that all of my emails are watched, as well. trust me, psychological profiling is a very real thing, & the gov't is the leading expert in it all - look at what has happened to the US population since 9/11. look at the bullshit polls that the media uses constantly (esp. in elections) to ramp up the herd instinct that has been so carefully nurtured by our society/gov't. & these polls are hardly ever accurate depictions of any population; even my statistics professor in undergrad gave us a lecture on it.
&&&&*** 2 things: First of all, I work at a University where these profs. with their PHds have their heads so far up their asses, you can't tell where their ass ends and their head begins. It's SICK. 2nd, as far as the US population, these "sheeple" (sheep-people) are so foolish, I read a poll that 70% of those that responded were FOR making middle-easterners (even those BORN IN THE US of mid-east descent) have MANDATORY ID cards. That includes me, born here, you, even though you are half... Americans are so gullable.
: anyway, i don't mean for this to be my soapbox, lecture, whatever. it's just an outlet. peace, my friends.
Good luck in the future.