Posted by pancho from pool0464.cvx25-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net (209.179.217.209) on Tuesday, November 26, 2002 at 12:01PM :
...signifying nothing.
Here, in this post from beth, is all the nonsense collected in one place...almost all of it. There isn't an "Assyrian" thing here...not one. There is only Christian against Muslim...and various nationalities conscripted on either side. This is more than boring...it is retrograde, looking firmly backwards while trying to go forward...can't be done.
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Written by George Stifo on 26 Nov 2002 16:06:14:
As an answer to: Ignorant Interpretation written by Mark on 25 Nov 2002 23:42:39:
Dear Mark,
When the basis of your entire argument is false, then your entire argument is false.
Just reading through the messages I noticed that you said the following:
"It was Hanna who urged the Bishops of Syrian Orthodox Churches ordering their followers to identify themselves as Syriac for the census and afterward. It was Hanna who traveled to Detroit U.S. to urge members of the CHaldean church to identify themselves as ethnically Chaldean on the CHaldean Church radio program.
It was Hanna who in posting after posting on the internet was justifying the slashes.
Now he says he had nothing to do with slashes"
Could you please tell us where you obtained this extremely inaccurate information? I have known Hanna for years and I speak to him almost on a daily basis, even during the census issue. As far as I know, the Bishops of the Syriac Orthodox Church in the US are against Hanna because he calls himself Assyrian as they are against any Western Assyrian. So how is he going to urge them?!!! All Hanna did was send the letters to the parishioners who were calling themselves Arabs or Turks urging them to register under the Assyrian/Chaldean/Syriac category instead of Arab, Turk, Syrian, Lebanese, or Iraqi. Do you see that as wrong? Would you rather that those people did not register under the category and instead registered under their country of citizenship? Remember Mark, the followers of the Syriac Orthodox Church who call themselves Assyrian will always register as Assyrian regardless of what. They did so in 1990 and they did so in 2000 and will do so in 2010.
Another thing is that Hanna had never gone to Detroit during the census issue. Actually, I do not even think that he traveled outside of California during that time. Where is your proof that he did any of those things that you are saying?
As for justifying the slashes, then it was not only Hanna who was justifying them. Zowaa (ADM), AUA, AANF, ADO, CFA, BNDP and others all justified them and supported them. Those are the parties that have the influence. Why not ask them instead of Hanna? I think that you are being the typical radical Eastern Assyrian who does not know what happened but knows that he should be blaming members of other churches. This is very typical. We have seen it for decades and will continue to see it as long as our so-called Eastern Assyrian nationalists do not have the courage to stand up to the Church of the East. If you think the Church of the East is not guilty of killing Assyrian nationalism, then you need to lift your head from the sand. The Church of the East has harmed Assyrian nationalism and continues to do so, on a daily basis.
If you paid any attention to any of the writings of Hanna, then you would have noticed that he always said, that the term "The Assyrian Church" should not be accepted in reference to the Church of the East. Instead, always use "The Assyrian Church of the East." Using the definite article "the" in the term "The Assyrian Church" when speaking about the Church of the East, denominationalizes the term Assyrian whether we like it or not. This is the reality that many of you do not want to accept.
I also noticed that Hanna always said that if we are not going to be denominationalizing the Assyrian term when talking about the Churches as the leaders of the Church of the East always do, then we might as well just drop from the title "Assyrian" from the Church because it is more harmful when it is there and being denominationalized. I would also rather keep it as a national name than make it a denominational name. If you and others want it to be a denominational name, then that tells a lot about what you actually are fighting for.
This is a challenge. Could you please show us one document that you wrote to the leaders of the Church of the East opposing the denominationalizing of the Assyrian name? Actually could you please list one document by ADM (Zowaa), AUA, AANF, ADO (Mtakasto), BNDP ... etc written to the leaders of the Church of the East opposing the denominationalizing of the Assyrian name?
Assyrian is a national name and if any Church (or its followers) using the Assyrian title is going to denominationalize the Assyrian name, then that Church is not fit to use the title "Assyrian" and is an enemy to all Assyrians and Assyrian nationalism.
George
-- pancho
-- signature .