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=> Re: On the Evidence of Prof. Karlsson

Re: On the Evidence of Prof. Karlsson
Posted by parhad (Guest) - Friday, September 24 2004, 20:31:56 (CEST)
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Paul Younan wrote:
>From
>
>http://www.visarkiv.se/mmm/media/assyrien/religi-e.htm
>
>
>"The Church of the East has its origin in what is now South East Turkey in the Christian church in Edessa (today Urfa), of which there are records from the end of the 2nd century. The name Nestorian was taken after Nestorius, whose doctrine was accepted in 484, after which Nestorianism was widely spread during the following thousand years.


..this is the kind of bullshit you tried to pull off before...Dean too. You start a paragraph telling us well know and undisputable facts which are verified in various neutral sources...then you sneak in this kind of sentence in which, for "proof" you give me back my own question. Your scholars may be content with this sort of flummery..it won`t fly here. This profesor`s mere statement..I don`t care in how many books, surrounded by how many simple statements of obvious fact..prooves not a damn thing.

I asked you..."how do you know...give me your EVIDENCE"...and you find a "scholar" who says, "we know because I just TOLD you so".

If that was all you gave me about the Romans..I would have rejected it..instead...and don`t you wish you had one here..you presented us with a neutral document no historian would argue with..it is THAT kind of proof I asked for...and you don`t have it...this professor`s statement is based on WHAT?

I was asking for your original sources..not the say-so of any professor...is this scholarship to you?

Give me HIS source for that statement..that Nestorianism was WIDESPREAD...and then tell me how you understand "widespread".

And Timur killed everybody...this is hardly an example pf "persecution" suffred by MILLIONS of Christians alone.

Give me the original source these sorts of statements come from...it was never a matter of not knowing your bullshit..we know it well and "professors" and "scholars" are as full of bullshit as anyone else...we KNOW your propaganda..I want evidence that it ISN`T propaganda...something like your map..or census figures..whatever you have no matter how flimsy..I need the fatcs this statement was derived from..I don`t need it REPEATED...that doesn`t make it true....okay?

By the end of the 13th century there were twelve Nestorian dioceses in a strip from Peking to Samarkand. At the height of their powers they were estimated to have had nearly 80 million members (Karlsson 1991.23).

..they were "estimated"? By whom? How? On what are these estimates based? Citing a refernce proves nothing..you could write (Hitler 1933.56) We are not children here.


This age of greatness came to an abrupt end, however. When Timur Lenk conquered Persia, Mesopotamia and Syria at the end of the 14th century, the civilian population was decimated. Of the Nestorian Christians only scattered remnants survived. Their most powerful stronghold came to be in the region between the two lakes Van (East Turkey) and Urmia (North West Iran)."

..what is "greatness" in this context? This sounds like one of the Christian priests passing as a scholar because he knows his own bullshit thoroughly..if you were that popular that you grew to such a size 1300 years...and were all that popular that people were lining up to join...why have you never even come close to those figures again...why in 700 years have you not managed to grow a whole bunch more happy converts? Who do you blame this time?

Get me the facts behind the estimates and statements..or tell me what they are based upon..as best you can..miracles don`t count.



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