The Inside Assyria Discussion Forum

=> response to dear lady

response to dear lady
Posted by parhad (Guest) - Wednesday, July 21 2004, 18:11:35 (CEST)
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I remember a comment I made to you in that conversation two years ago that if Abraham never left Ur or Mesopotamia, and his children were born, and their children, eventually Jesus would have been born in Mesopotamia as well.

...He may have been...but his father was Yahwe...and he was NEVER an Assyrian god or anywhere near to someone Assyrians would have respected. Jesus was a nice fellow...but nothing he brought into the world was new. There was loving kindness and hard work and sacrfice in BetNahrain when there was none among the Hebrews who were practicing human sacrifice. The thing that makes Jesus JESUS is this Messiah business and THAT is Hebrew and not Assyrian. No one needed saving more than Hebrews and no one was less capabale of doing it themsleves than Hebrews and no one was in dire need of a Heaven somewhere away from Jerusalem more than the Hebrews. The Gilgamesh Epic is OUR bible...a simple one with no blood and guts..it tells the tale of a kingly man, who yet lacks a woman`s wisdom... a noble man who starts out asking those inane questions the Jews did...but who comes to realize that loving his family and being the best man/king he can be during his time on earth IS Heaven....that seeking more than that is folly and arrogance...and with that philosophy and religion in mind the descendants of Gilgamesh were able to build half of civilization without bothering what came AFTER..while the Jews went on squatting in the dust, eating bugs and mapping out the UNIVERSE and ETERNITY and MORALITY while ripping open the wombs of each other`s wives to prove the point.

******* Yahweh means what? Is it a name? Or referring to someone's name they (the Jews) didn't know? The funniest thing i've heard Canadian Christians say about Muslims is, "They worship Allah while we worship God", it's such a silly statement because Allah means God in Arabic, it's another word, in another language, for the same 'being'. Allah is not another God other then "God"! Don't you think the same goes for Yahweh?

...there hasnĒt been a serial killer in the history of humanity that comes close to Yahwe. Who demands people be killed for pissing against a wall...what kind of god demands a man go back to a village where he spared the inncoent and kill every man, woman, child and animal? This is a god?

*******Jesus was more then a nice fellow Mr.. Parhad, he didn't marry a 13 year old 3aisha and forty or so other women as Mohammad did. If Jesus and the Messiah business were not Assyrian, why did the Assyrians/Astrologers follow the Star to his birthplace to honor him as a king?

...Christians men also married 13 year olds..everybody did back then...Juliet is 14 when she was traded in marriage to a man much older...it was the way back then when life expectancy rates were so low...there have been plenty of teenagers sold off in marriage in Christian lands...Muhammad worked for his older wife before marrying her...and Mormons would have multiple wives if the civil law allowed it.

....Christian men had concubines and whores to compensate them for one wife...in Islam whores were not encouraged...far better that women were taken into decent homes and cared for equally and respected as wives than allowed to work the back alleys of Rome so men could fuck and abuse them til they were no longer clean enough to work at which time they starved to death in rags while the honorable Christian, who could get homeless 12 year old girls and their six year old brothers to service him, continued his "monogamous" ways.

*******There is more then the Gilgamesh Epic which could be our Bible, there is the Enuma Elish etc, but if you believe in these writings you have to admit that in these Cuneiform tablets there were God's mentioned not only one God.


...Yahwe isnĒt the only god to the Jews either...there were others and the only way Yahwe wins out is that the Jews kill all of their own people who wonĒt give up their gods. Yahwe himself says, "I am a jealous god"...that means there were others....he also says, "Thou shalt have no gods before me"...he never says he is the only one and he is pissed if people refuse to believe in him..he just wants to be number one in a field of many...Jews did not believe in one god till they killed all those who had their own gods whoĒd never bothered anybody. This one god business has been the greatest scourge people have had to deal with...it allows fanatics to satisfy their own bloodlust and lay it at their godĒs feet.

Gilgamesh himself was not just a "kingly man" or just a "noble man", he was a half "God"! I'm not saying that Assyrians worshipped more then one God, but more then one "being" or "God' was mentioned in Cuneiform text!

...Assyrians worshiped many manifestations of god...and lots of people had men who were half gods. We have Bush.


...The distingusihing feature of Christianity is not Christ`s lovliness, but this Jewish Messiah business..had Jesus been born in BetNahrain he would NOT have been a "Messiah"..he would have been one of any civilized people, men and women, who helped further the cause of human dececny...something you can see in the bible the Hebrews were sadly lacking...except when they rubbed elbows with us..for which Yahwe called them whores anyway. It is indeed a great tragedy Jesus wasn`t born among us..we would not have insisted he had to be butchered so we could benefit..we knew how to benefit without slitting the throats of our first born or getting someone to crucify them OR getting Americans to kill them...and we sure as hell wouldn`t have played at eating him and drinking his blood..those were not games in Assyria and they sure as hell were no part of any religion of ours...those were Hebrew games and they`ve made them yours.


********* Christianity is of a higher spiritual level then Islam, which is distinguishing.

...thatĒs just your prejudice. Had you ben raised Muslim youĒd feel the same way about that team...Islam calls it blasphemy to say god had a child and they think itĒs disgusting to insist he gets killed in so babraric a manner, worse than beheading...and that his followers would eat his fleah and drink his blood. Muhammad dies peacefully in bed surrounded by his family and friends...Jesus has to be torn and whipped and sodomized, stripped and nailed to a tree where heĒs hung out to dry. This is about as inhumane a thing as you can wish on your "dear son". Christianity is born in blood, in human sacrifice...AND to top it off and distinguish it from other savages, the prophet and son of god has to be cannibalized...thatĒs of high moral and spiritual order to you? Is it any wonder that children raised on this gore have grown to make Christianity the bloodiest religion the world has ever seen?


The Muslims also consider Jesus a prophet Mr.. Parhad, they just don't believe that he is the "son of God".

...Muslims REJECT this son of god business. They consider it blasphemy of a tall order. They accept Jesus and Moses and the rest of them as prophets and messengers...as they consider Muhammad to be the last in that series.

And I still don't think it's a Jew Religion, they took the Epics of Mesopotamia and converted them into some Jewish tales, but they are not originally Jewish, and by the way where are the Jews originally from anyway?

..of course itĒs a Jew religion...Jesus was Jewish, his parents, siblings, friends, neighbors, disciples, teachers and followers for the first 100 years after his death were all Jewsish..it was for throwing open membership in the new cult to gentiles that Paul nearly got killed. There were NO Christians when our Abgar putz converted Assyrian...he could only have converted them to a sort of reformed off=shoot of Judaism. The whole Messiah thing is a uniqely Jewish belief..they NEEDED a Messiah...the Assyrians never had need of one...never had one in their religion..not till we made Jews of ourselves who canĒt now manage to build a toilet and need hosts to fight for us...the Jews HAD no hosts of their own...we had the best.

...Yahwe is a desert tribal god that Abram picked up after we threw him and his incestous brood out.

...Jesus was Jew..he said so himself and his father was a Jew god. Of course they stole from us..but that kind of flattery can only go so far. As to where the Jews were from, they only identified themselves as such when they returned from working in Egypt...because that "chosen" land couldn`t even support the few people living in it so they had to sell themselves into slavery periodically just to eat...everything about them stank of sheephit ad NOTHING of the sweet orchards along the Tigris

******* Judaism was a Religion not a Nationality when Abe got pissed off in Mesopotamia and took his camp gear and went off camping with his family looking for a "new" God. Only later did it become a Nationality. Jesus ancestors were Sumerians and the Jews were not from Egypt Mr.. Parhad, they were from Mesopotamia originally. Abrahams father Terah for instance was born in Nippur!

...the Jews were NOT from Mesopotamia...they were in Judea eating bugs and scratching their behinds. Jesus is descended form the line of David who was decidedly not Sumerian but a minor Jewish thug and adulterer...such is the stuff of Jewish kings. Jews went to Egypt often because their chosen land only grew enough goat turds to feed them sporadically...they went to find work and graze their goats...then as now that "chosen" land was useless...thatĒs how comethey were able to "seize" it. Imagine their neighborĒs surprise when they read that silly bible years later and learned for the first time that the Jews had to fight to "win" that rocky wasteland. They were welcome to it.

...As far as Abram goes..that kind of person and family values were not welcome in BetNahrain..he knew it and left to find the kind of people who DID sleep with their daughters, lose their wives in the desert and lie to the police about it and sacrifice their own sons. He was no loss to BetNahrain.

<And remember Mr. Parhad, the Jews don't worship Jesus,

...of course they do. His original followers were all Jews...Protestants donĒt worship Mary...so? They are still Christians...The only difference between Jews and neo=Jews is that the neos, who call themselves by the name of the son of Yahwe, instead of Yahwe himself, is that they believe the Jewish Messiah promised to the Jews is Jesus...whereas the Jews, the pure and unreformed Jews, believe the Messiah is not yet come. But itĒs ALL centered around this Messiah business..and Assyrians NEVER had any use for a Messiah and heaven on earth by and by when you die..they HAD it while they were alive and well...

..of course they do and did from the beginning. His disciples were all Jews as were his friends and teachers and god. In his lifetime he was nothing BUT a Jew...of a mildly different perspective and during his lifetime and for at least 100 years after you HAD to be a Jew in order to follow Christ at all...and it was for opening up membership in the new Jewish cult to gentiles that Paul nearly got killed. Christians were Jews from the outset...especially as far as Christ`s first and foremost followers...as was the first "pope". Not all Jews followed him but then not all Assyrian Christians follow the same Christ.

and from my point of view the problem is not what Jesus said, the problem is our interpretation of what he said, and of course the Church has been a problem.

..."we" have no idea what he said. Our knowledge of the man and the events comes from questionable sources. I still say it as an insult and a deep slander to tell us the Assyrians threw their culture away for a Jewish one...what more than likely happened is that the Romans imposed their new State religion on us as they did on everyone they came in contact with...as their descendants in Europe imposed Jesus on Afria and the New World..and we KNOW none of them willingly became Christian..why would they? They had more reson to remain faithful to the gods and cultures that gave birth to their people and grew from them and with them...converting to Jesus would be like converting to Martians who come here babbling about a god we never heard of...you know the Romans converted us through force as the Church worked hand in hand with later governments to FORCE people into a unfied, national, state-sponsored "religion"..that ain`t religion at ALL. What the indigenous Assyrians and Apaches and Hottentots and Aztecs had was a religion...Christianity was merely a tool for enforcing conformity in the various lands a Christian empire conquered..with no respect shown to the native gods and cultures which is a FAR CRY from the Tower of Babel and all that implies..we were INCLUSIVE, Christians became EXCLUSIVE..and that was pure Hebrew and then Roman all the way.

******* Just because some Western Christians used Christianity in which ever way they saw fit does not mean they understood what it truly means to be Christian,

..."SOME"?...."SOME"??? You cannot call a medicine "useful" or "miraculous" if it saves ten people and kills 1000 who take it. Christianity has brought nothing new into the world...Assyrian parents were loving their children, obeying laws, worshipping gods, believing in a higher morality..as were others around the world LONG before Jesus came. There isnĒt a SINGLE attribute you can give him or any saying of his that was new or different...except the Jewish parts about a Messiah...and no one else NEEDED a Messiah back then more than Jews..and later Assyrians who turned Christian

...You couldnĒt get Thalidomide licensed as a pain reliever for pregnant woman based on the "success" rate Christianity has had...


and it also does not mean that Assyrian Christians support their actions.

...what do you mean? They are supporting the actions of the United States..a Christian country.

Western Christians were using Christianity, it's like those people who steal, lie, and cheat, and do all sorts of things to people and then go to Church every Sunday all dressed up in their Sunday Mass Masks.

...you just described the people who invented Christianity, after executing its founder..the Romans made Christianity what it is today...your own brand couldn÷t build a toilet either and has been chased out of every country the Romans didnĒt first conquer. That fact alone, that the Roman Empire would "convert" to Christ should have been enough to warn people away..and it DID scare them away..which is why the Romans dragged people kicking and screaming to Jesus and raped their children into believing daddy and mommy ran willingly to the arms of the Roman EmpireĒs state religion. IsnĒt it Assyrian Christians, who "got it right" whoĒve trusted the Romans each and every time...only to be used by them and dumped..arenĒt we even now placing all our hopes in American Imperial troops? All the REAL Christianity did for us is lead us up to the same executionerĒs block it led Jesus to...only we start crying and bawling and pulling our deeds of land from our sweat soaked bottoms and begging to be let go at the last minute and allowed to live in a Triangle. We GOT just what Christ promised we would...weĒve earned crucifixion by being as unfit to live on earth as that poor befuddled young man was.


This is not Christianity and this is not what Jesus meant for Christians to be like. When the Christian "Crusades" were going on, not only Muslims were killed but also Christian Middle Eastern people!

..The Crusaders killed everyone..they slaughtered all Jews across Europe in their path and on the third Crusade they attacked Constantinople and murdered all the Christians they could and liberated a Christian city rather than attack and infidels. Jesus meant Christianity, as it was called much later, as a means to get crucified..he said so..told his followers to follow his example. If his followers listened to him they too got executed...and if we question Rome today, or Bush, we too will get executed. Assyrians who converted got EXACTLY what Christ did..what he told them to expect...why canĒt you people be quiet and get led off to crucifixion like your Lord was..like he promised you would be..how come all this kicking and screaming and calling on the United Nations at the end?

I asked you in that conversation 2 years ago and I ask again, why didn't the Assyrians create a Holy Book out of their Religious knowledge, so that Assyrians today could have followed it?

..there are over a million clay tablets being kept under lock and key 100 years after they were discovered. Had those tablets contained a SINGLE line that reafirmed the bible..you can bet they would have been shouted to the world. Even the Dead Sea Scroills went through the most tortuous and byzantine trail before being SNEAKED out to the public...why?

**********Here is what I read has been translated from Clay Tablets.
http://www.world-mysteries.com/pex_2.htm

...what you list below is no different and a whole lot better than the blood guts youĒll get in the Hebrew bible AND the New Testicle. Jews stuck it out with their brute of a god. Ashur was far more humane and sophisticated, yet we are told we threw him away to follow THAT jackass. We didnĒt..we were raped into Christ as was everyone else who today believes his ancestors "converted"...they were not inspired to adopt Christianity...they were FORCIBLY converted on pain of death.

...Had we kept faith with Ashur we would have been in a far different and far better place today.=...things couldnĒt BE worse for us today in our own Homelands where weĒre paying the Jews to bomb Baghdad to save Jerusalem.

...we DID leave our culture and religion in those tablets..yet all we ever hear is that they contain dull "business documents"...and we believe it. But even if nothing else survived, the Epic of Gilgamesh states our underlying beliefs very well...and they are to love and honor your family...build the walls well...be the best husband, man, father, son that you can, to listen to your mother/wife, the Divine Barmaid...to focus your energies on sanitation and hygiene and physical health here on earth...and to leave what you can`t know alone..it belongs to the eternal mysteries we haven`t the means or equipment to begin to figure out...to not lose sight of THIS world for hallucinations of the next..which is EXACTLY what the Hebrews couldn`t stand..for their just deserts in THIS life got them a goat turd "kingdom" on a rock in Jerusalem..while our focus on THIS life got us a Nineveh..and they never forgave us for it...and today they FINALLY got our boys to cheer its destruction..that`s Assyrian?


********** Why didn't the Iraqi Muslims descendants of the Ancient Assyrians help a little more in the preservation and translations of cuneiform tablets? Some of them I guess would rather take a stroll in Makka, no offence.

...what are you saying? In the first place the land has been looted not just 100 years ago but now and from the beginning its treasures have ben taken by the West. Dr Donny George, an Assyrian, was head of the antiquities department in Iraq for years and Iraqi archaelogists are respected professionals in their field whoĒve headed digs, pusblished in journals around the world, written books and delivered lectures...they have ALWAYS revered and respected our common heritage...it is the Americans who found the thugs they needed to rip our hertitage off so some day a piece will be "found" in Israel in a museum..or a private collectors bathroom.

>
>All we`re saying is that it is preposterous for anyone to say Christians are the ONLY Assyrians allowed and then set rules and regulations that THEY will enforce to see if they`ll THINK about letting a Muslim or a Kurd join.
>
>********* I think if anyone from Mesopotamia considers himself Assyrian, it should be fine, regardless of Religion, but I have not heard many Iraqi-Muslims say such things, nor Kurdish-Muslims.

...you have made Assyrian synonymous with Christian..of course they reject that outright as would any true Assyrian. What they DO counts far more with them than what you TALK a lot about. They are in the country, Muslim and Christian, doing the hard work of preservation and they have done it marvellously well...which counts a lot more than talking about it from Chicago, where 80,000 Christian Assyrians couldnĒt be bothered to move ONE man out of the way so the city could finally install the THIRD Assyrian monument to be built anywhere in the world in 2500 years, after six years of a threatened lawsuit, by an "ASSYRIAN" stopped it cold...while sending death and destruction to BetNahrain and the ensuing instabillity which results under cover of which the CHRISTIANS have trashed and robbed our treasures yet again.

...What was done in Chicago must produce a smile in Iraq when Muslims conside that once "free" to be Assyrian..the best you people could do, as ONE "Nation", was to STOP the installation of an Assyrian monument, going so far as to SUE them if they dared do such a thing..and this one jackass Assyrian is allowed to get away with saying that installing the monument a block and a half from the Oriental Institute is unacceptable to HIm because college kids play frisbee and picnic there...while you do nothing but build churches and sing the praises of Yahwe and his kid..what could PROVE to them better than anything they could have dreamed up that you are NOT Assyrians in any meaningful sense of the word...just Christians using Ashur where it suits you.

...and they haven`t seen us do much to secure the nation...though there are many Assyrian Christians living and working and fighting for their country. For us in America to impose standards..for you to say YOU haven`t been convinced...means nothing to them..why would it? Do you care what they say about you only being a Christian sect who, on arrival on Freedom`s Shore let us all see what you meant by "Assyrian" all those years in only building Churches? Where is the culture that MAKES an "ethnicity"? YOU are the ones screaming to the world ,"WE ARE CHRISTIANS"..and the few feelble attempts, the drawings of an Assyrian king..the plywood chariot and sequined gowns and balloons convince no one that we are REALLY PURE Assyrians!


********** Don't judge a book by it's cover! How do you know i'm one of those people? I don't even go to Church here because I feel that I don't learn anything at our Church. I read the Bible on my own and have a Church in my heart, and the Bible is not the only book I read.

...you obviously donĒt have Ashur in your heart...Assyrian was a religion before it was a nationalism or empire...if you remove an Assyrian from your heart and put a Jew there...what kind of an Assyrian does that make you? Would you call a Christian someone who removes Jesus from her heart to put Buddha there? Christianity is a religion the Romans forced on a lot of people who remained in the religion because as children they had precious little choice. Had you been taken as a child to a Muslim family, or a Shinto, or a Jewish one, you would have grown up Assyrian in name and outside covering...but faithful to whatever religion surrounded you...I too was surrounded by Christians...taken to church..I even had Jesuits delivered to my door in Baghdad to try to "save " me and make a Christian in fact out of me..I rejected them every time..as I would have had I been whisked away to China as a baby to be raised in their religion, or anywhere else. I had the mark of Ashur on me from birth and NOTHING..not Shinto, Zen or Christ could make the slightest dent...I just had to grow into Ashur, thatĒs all. You might yet do that.

**********Even if we are not "pure" Assyrians, we are the closest thing to the ancient Assyrians on earth today, if not in anything we actually do, then simply the way we look, the shape of our eyes and nose, the texture of our hair, I bet you can tell an Assyrian-Christian from a "Assyrian"-Muslim!

...There is no Aryan=Type...there is no Assyrian=Type. This is discredited Fascist PURITY OF BLOOD. You just lead a sheltered life where your family were the only Assyrians you saw. We have Chaldeans who have green eyes and red hair and creamy skin you wonĒt find in Ireland...we have pure blonde blue=eyed Assyrians we have Assyrians with marked Mongolian features..we have every kind of Assyrian there is on this planet in "Types"...there are Mexicans here in Mexico who look more Assyrian than I do. This is merely Racist thinking...there are no TYPES. We resemble LOTS of people and LOTS of people could have walked off those wall carvings.

...Besides which Muslim Assyrians have a whole other empire to revel in...it is you who made Christian synonymous with Assyrian so that when Christ lost in BetNahrain you refused to recognize the "theft" of ASSYRIA..when our people turned to Islam in great enough numbers to take the religion and the CULTURE of BetNahrain to Spain and the New World..for which they`ve never been forgiven...the way you want them to be "Assyrian" practically means they have to renounce 1300 years of their history and achievements..and they won`t do that. Instead they incorpprate their Assyrian Assyrian roots into their later flowering as Muslim Assyrians..as you could see in the old Iraqi web page where the cross was as pronounced as the Crescent BOTH of which are Assyrian symbols..as well as the Lamasu...and they know and I know and you know that if you had an "Assyrian site"...you`d have a Lamasu without balls and lots of crosses...but NO Muslim symblos..and that says it all.

***********I don't think they should renounce 1300 years of history. They were Assyrians once upon a time, but today they "do nothing Assyrian"!

...is calling for the destruction of Iraq an Assyrian thing to do? The people of Iraq are fighting to defend BetNahrain from a combined assault by Christian nations and an Assyrian cheering section. The things you call "Assyrian" are all Christian anyway.

Their music, if they listen to it, since many Muslims only listen to their Religious Muslim music since Music is against the teachings of Islam is hardly Assyrian Music, I never heard ancient Assyrians say "Allah ow Akbar" and continue this phrase for never ending hours! Your calling us Jews? Muslims are like modern day Puritans!

Christian Puritans made music and smiling a sin and they settled America and rule it today. You have no way of knowing that Arab music wasnĒt Assyrian orginally...hell, we call Arab any Assyrian who SINGS an Arabic song. There are many words we think of as having come into Assyrian from Arabic...that were ours to begin with...you have no way of knowing how those instruments were used by our people origianlly...the instruments were the same and IĒm sure the music shared lots of similarities. How many times can you repeat Hail Mary full of grace? really..you must not make light of the ridiculous beliefs of others when yours can so easily be ridiculed.

And about the Kurds, who said that we don't want to live in peace with them or that they cant "join", but where it concerns the Kurds, they are not the Indigenous people of the North of Iraq and it seems at times they don't want to let us "join" in a region which is historically our own.

...in the first place, no one there trusts Christians..so you`re screwed from the get go. If we are to talk to the world we have to use its definitions, not Hannas. As Tiglath pointed out, the United Nations, which is the recognized authority on displaced people etc, says that 400 years of continued occupancy makes people indigenous..it doesn`t matter if the land was empty when they moved in, it doesn`t matter how they moved, it doesn`t matter if there were original owners or ten warring factions or how much killing they had to do in order to saty...look at Israel..if they stay that long they are "indigenous". So at the least we should find another word to describe what you mean or people will discount our entire argument once they realize we make up definitions to suit ourselves.

******** I don't think people trust based on "religion" these days, it's seems to be all about the $$$! Whoppi the "United Nations", and who said the "United Nations" knows it all?

...the United States declared Afghanis and Iraqis legitimate targets for reprisal because of what 19 Saudis did...since none of these people share anything MORE than they do a common religion..and as weĒve seen a concerted effort to slander an ENTIRE faith, something we havenĒt witnessed this deliberate since Christians damned ALL Jews...I would say it IS based on religion...entirely.

...You are living on stolen land here in America...which hasn`t even been "American" for the 400 years the world recognizes as the minimum time required under International Law to make its theft legitimate...and I doubt any Assyrian is going to give land back to any native and move out.

***** I live in Canada, and I know the lands were stolen from the Native Indians, and it's the most unfortuante thing that could happen to a Nation but at least Canada has given some rights to the Aboriginals.

...they have gotten no "rights" beyond what the Law allows. They have some "compensations"...not rights. To be a RIGHT it has to be extended to everyone., TheyĒve merely been thrown a bone or two...they got nothing the theives couldnĒt easily part with. You still wonĒt give your house back to them even if they can PROVE they owned the land first. Imagine Afro=Americans going to Africa and demanding their tribal land back, the ones they were stolen away from to become slaves in the New World..no matter how just your claim..you will get nothing "back".


...The Kurds are "indigenous" by all standards of civilized speech. If you mean they aren`t the original owners then say so. But that gets us nowhere because you or anyone else can`t prove original title. Finding Assyrian treasures in the ground doesn`t make the people living above the soil Assyrian because they "say so". The Aramaic language was spoken by lots of people and lots of people coming to BetNahrain 1000 years ago would have learned it and passed it down and you have no way of knowing if your family line extends back to the original people or merely 600 years ago and your Christian religion doesn`t prove YOU were there from the beginning of the Christian presence in BetNahrain. For us to make such a claim also brings ridicule on our heads.

What WE say doesn`t matter anywhere else...I don`t even buy the argument..and I`m hardly an enemy of my heritage...I AM against any idea we put out that only increases the divisions..as this latest war against BetNahrain will divide us and breed more hatred for generations to come..it has made things MUCH WORSE..not better.


******* So tell us of some ideas that can be put out which will unite rather then increase the divisions. Who are you afraid will be divided? Assyrians? Who is it that you want to Unite? I want the whole human race to be united, but I doubt my wish will come true in this lifetime.

...wishing wonĒt do. Calling off this war and paying indemnities and apologizing would be a good first step. We always had it in our power to teach and show by example...the American PEOPLE have not been hated yet..itĒs their government that is despised increasingly. If we really had any good faith we could lead by example and prevail upon all the people of BetNahrain to follow a better path...realizing that Saddam was kept in power by America and used until no longer needed...it has been OUR meddling in their lives for the benefit of the same handful of Corps who savage us and ruin our environment and blight our lives back home that has caused the greatest damage. We are in no position to export democracy...we donĒt know what it is any longer.

The first step is to get out. If there has to be a bloodbath then we need to stay out of it...that goes for selling them weapons as well. You canĒt control or shape a PeopleĒs destiny..which is what we say we are doing, only by guiding them into our pockets. After the bloodbath, if it must be...they might be in a mood to compromise...and they might even avoid it altogether. No new countries need to be formed if people living everywhere will be respected.,...but that means the Western Powers have to stop playing their favorits game of divide and conquer..they have to stop meddling to give one side promises if theyĒll do as theyĒre told and then whispering something else into another faction, or the governmentĒs ear. People think with a nation theyĒll be in a better position to defend themselves and keep their cultures alive...they wonĒt be any more secure as nations..it didnĒt save Iraq...and if their cultures could be respetced where they are, they might not chase the holy grail of nationhood..or triangularhood.

...Assyrians were never denied their rights in Iraq..those are the lies the Church puts out to justify their agitation for a Christian enclave. What theyĒve sufferd has been for the ACTS they committed which THEY then laid at the feet of "Assyrianism"..it was dishonest of them to do so, but so what else is new. There is nothing in being Assyrian that demands a triangle..not when we have an entire country...Iraqis are killing ALL who collaborate to day, not just Christians. The Church has been behind this attempt to make it appear that their followers are being singled out and for being Assyrian of all things...this is THEIR lie...promoted and taught in those village churches Saddam buldozed and ANY president in his right mind would have done so. The Church WANTS discord and dissention and if it has to get some of its people killed in the process...it wonĒt be the first time it tried to benefit from Human sacrifice..thatĒs how you all get into heaven, remember?

Even if some Assyrians converted and became Kurds, the Kurds were a invading force in the North of Iraq. Nonetheless that doesn't mean we should not be able to live with them, but we also deserve to have our right's in this region.

...Under a democracy you have no minority rights..not unless the majority wants to give you any. Blacks and women too, had no RIGHTS that were promised anywhere..not even when the Constitution said we are equal under the Law...it took years of fighting but mostly educating to get the majority to ALLOW minorities some rights under the law and women were NEVER in the minority. If the Kurds dominate in that region...thatĒs just the way Life works...we can get only what they vote to give...therefore it is incumbant on US to stop insulting and slandering them for what a few have done...we have thugs enough on our side.

...Our boys donĒt want mutual respect..they want BLOOD. To them any rights...including full equality, under a Kurdish state or government is anathema, on Christian PRINCIPLE...they would far prefer to have all Christians in Iraq slaughtered, MASSCREED and RAPED and have HEADS CUT OFF and children SODOMIZED, the more gruesome the manner the better....in order to arouse the sympathy of those hearts and minds, the White Foreign ones, that they need IN CASE they can get enough pity to get what the Kurds FOUGHT to get.

...you get citizenship rights anywhere you behave the part of citizens. If they won`t allow you to run your village churches with madrassahs in the basement that teach impressionable minds sedition...they are simply doing what any country would do. You are allowed to worship Jesus all you want to.,..what you are NOT allowed to do is to use your religion as PROOF that you are the original owners of the land....that NO ONE would let you do. If the country is Iraq, or becomes Kurdistan or Tazmania and that name is recognized by the body of nations as a legitimate theft, sanctified by Time, as their`s all have been...then they get to set the rules for citizenship..as America does...and as no Apache who survived gets any Apache Rights..you will not get any Assyrian Rights..and that`s normal and expected and legal in every way..you may not LIKE it...but then who has?

...cut off...to be continued



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