The Inside Assyria Discussion Forum

=> Re: Question to Pacho

Posted by pancho (Guest) - Sunday, May 29 2005, 2:09:33 (CEST)
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Agade wrote:
>First off I want to say hello,

...hello and welcome

since this is the first time that Im on this forum (I think). After skimming through a few of your posts, pancho, I just wanted to ask you if you are a Muslim Assyrian.

...that is a contradiction in terms to me...it includes the name of two gods...and while I far prefer paganism than this bloodlust of monotheism...I follow Ashur...I am not anything else. The name of our god is right in our name..at the front, so people can`t miss it..."ASHUR-ians"...as it is in CHRIST-ianity...you can`t be both..you can only be one.

And if so, does your family and freinds around you say the samething?

...No, they are as stunned and dismayed, for the most part, as everyone else is. I was raised with the same stories the rest of you were...they never made any sense to me and though several churches gave it a try I found them all repugnant and insulting...but that was just a feeling...now I know they are and I know why and how...or feel I can give a pretty good explanation of it.

Im very interested because all my life I knew Assyrians and they all were christians. I also knew, common sense, that a lot of Assyrians accepted Islam (hence I did not say convert, because we all beleive in the same God) but I have never met any. The one I did meet(Muslim from Iraq), said that he and his family are Muslim and recognize themselves as Arab. And we got to talking and he said that he was not sure if he was Assyrian because he was taught he was an Arab; but he was from Tikrit.

..it`s common knowledge that Saddam`s family converted a while back..as did many many Christians who just couldn`t see the point of fighting it..if you`re going to dump Ashur because Jesus serves you better...why then wouldn`t you one day dump Jesus because Muhammad serves you better? And I`m sure one day all of them will dump all of them because a new one serves them better. I`ll just stick with Ashur.

We got into great depths in our discussion and our conlusion was that to be Assyrian is not to be Christian and to be Arab is not to be Muslim. Do you agree with this?

...definitely.

...There are Arab Jews and Arab Christians...and there are now Israeli Arabs as well as Israeli Christians...though those terms are awkward, though not as preposterous as calling them Jew-Christians...or Muslim-Jews, because the name conects TWO religions...and that`s the same problem with the term "Assyrian Christian"...there just can`t be any such thing, if you`re to be logical about it and shave your tongue too....

...to me an Arab is one who is born in Arabia. What they usually mean to say is that they are part of an Arab FEELING, or community of like-minded people sharing some major things in common..but even Lawrence of Arabia said it was impossible to make an "Arab" out of an Arab..that the dessert tribesmen he dealt with had no concept of "Arab"..they were tribal first and foremost...and it frustrated Lawrence and the British no end. They came later to see themselves as "Arab" as a way of presenting a united front to the collosus of European Christianity...there is an English Speaking World and an Arabic Speaking World..but in both worlds people are very aware and jealous of their differences as well as proud of what unites them...Americans, New Zealanders and Scots are part of the English Speaking World..yet they know damn well there are major distinctions too...same with "Arabs".

To be an Arab or Assyrian or Jew is an ethnicity, just like being Mexican, Korean so and so forth.

...let me add a little something if I may, there is today a Mexico and a Korea, they are countries..there is no "Assyria", there is only Iraq...in the old days your religion was also your ethnicity also your geography, your food, your morality, your clothing, your music, your everything. Those days are long gone.

...The "Assyrians" still have BetNahrain, but are divided by religion and hatred with the added problem that the Christians who feel they are the REAL "Assyrians" will not accept any Muslim Assyrians and not even other Christians, unless they too convert to the one narrow brand of Christianity the boys espouse...the one that got Iraq murdered this time around.

..the boys are content to see Betnahrain destroyed in revenge for denying Jesus...and along with the Muslims, whom they can sort of understand refusing Jesus, they wish even MORE death and destruction to those Christians who refuse THEIR Jesus. This is insanity of course..it isn`t religion.

..ethnicity is a slippery concept in the best of conditions...what with jet travel and so much mixing going on, it`s hard to define an ethnicity any longer..for instance, the children of a Hungarian Jew and a Canadian Catholic...who convert at sixteen to Buddihsm, were born in Bombay but grew up in Mozambique are of what "ethnicity"? It`s safest to say you are an earthling and let it go at that.

When a person is conceived they are who they are(an Arab, Assyrian,Chinese, etc.) and then religion is imposed on them; Christianity, Islam, Judiasim, Hindusim.

..I`d say when you`re conceived you`re only human...you have nothing in your gentic structure that makes you an Arab or Chinese...unless of course we stick to things like eye shape or hook nose..but you could take an Arab infant at three days old and raise her perfectly Chinese...neither she, nor you nor any Chinese would ever be able to tell the differnece...without looking.

..the rest of the stuff is tacked on later. That`s what so scary about these boys...they really aren`t sure of who they are..not ever. They can`t be. They aren`t able to question or ascertain anything for themselves...you could take any one of them and whisk them back in time..or to any other culture today and they would grow up spouting and mouthing just what THOSE adults told them to with as much fervor but with as little conviction besides blustering bad manners they yelp their Christianity with. Their hysteria comes from that...from never being really certain of anything...because it`s all second-hand hearsay and they attempt to drown out their own uncertainy by shouting a lot..like all born agains.

..I mean think about it...Peter and the Rabbits tell each other they are ASSYRIANS...and have to then look in the mirror at themselves...that kind of slpit between fantasy and reality can be maddening to live with.

...You can see in their style of discussion and argument how they were taught..it was done by rote..by cramming things into their heads..punishing them if they didn`t "learn"...meaning repeat back exactly what they were told with NO variations..and rewarding them the LESS they questioned and searched for themselves, in other words they were rewarded for NEVER figuring anything out for themselves!!! That`s pretty scary. They really have nothing to say of their own..nothing in their heads but what was PUT there..like a tape recording..that`s why they get so frustrated and angry when you don`t "learn" from them...their notion is that they repeat to you what was repeated to them over and over..which THEY then learned to repeat, over and over...but if you refuse to play along and repeat it over and over too, but rather ask questions or expose weak spots...as they never dared to do for fear of punishment..they go ape shit and call you a stupid person who "refuses to learn the truth" and EVIL too! That`s how convinced they are that what was poured into their ears was "knowledge" and "truth"...but act as if they haven`t the faintest idea of what they speak.

It is impossible for them to do anything but repeat the lessons taught to them and since they never managed or dared to question or laugh or refuse to play the parrot`s part...they are OUTRAGED that you can laughingly blow them and their god away...and waltz down the road, with them hurling insults at your mother after you...trying one last time to scare you by saying you`ll go to hell and be denied the pleasure of spending ETERNITY WITH THEM!!!

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Question to Pacho Agade - Saturday, May 28 2005, 22:29:59 (CEST)
- Re: Question to Pacho pancho - 05/29 02:09

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