The Inside Assyria Discussion Forum

=> Re: let`s cut the crap...

Re: let`s cut the crap...
Posted by pancho (Guest) - Friday, June 3 2005, 3:50:26 (CEST)
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Yes, there are good people of all religions, and bad ones.... Jesus was trying to promote the good people...

..and Jesus wasn`t a Christian, or an Assyrian or Egyptian..he was a Jew fulfilling Mosiac Law andf Moses wasn`t an Assyrian either. Lots of people in BetNahrain were promoting good people way before Jesus...I still don`t see why you take to the newer version of what the Assyrians were doing long before...you think Jesus invented Love and Goodness?
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>>**********Right …right… the Assyrians converted into Islam freely and Genghis Khan was a ballerina too.
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>...he was married to a Christian. You have no evidence at all that Assyrians were forced into Islam..none at all...not outside church nonsense.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ The evidence that Assyrians were forced into Islam is that one cannot recognize any Assyrian features in modern day Arabs of Mesopotamia, and in Iraq, only things preserved by accident.

..that is ridiculous..especially as any proof. There are Christians you can`t tell aprt form Arabs or Persians..you people all deal in stereotypes..you have fixed in your minds what an "Arab" looks like...and an "Assyrian" looks like...I suppose all Blacks and Asians look alike to you...look at the bas-reliefs of Assyrian campaigns against the Arabs of that day..of THAT day..and besides the dress and hair styles, do you see any startling differences?

..what accident..it was no accident that Iraq expended so much of its wealth and hopes in uncovering Babylon...which has been blasted and the parts buried by Christians..what are you talking about???

The Assyrian Identity was wiped out of their memory for the most part.

..you Christians have NO memory of anything Assyrian either..all you do is make your Christian minority customs "Assyrian". At least Muslims don`t play that game.


They have denounced anything Assyrian, as the "lower" types of Muslims have burned statues of Buddha’s everywhere.

...who are the "they"? Are there not enough Christian thugs to go around? What have Christians just finished doing to Iraq? Is this a higher type to you? On the Iraqi web page there is a cross as well as a Lamasu and the Crescent..would any of you do the same?

They have also destroyed a lot of the ancient Assyrian artifacts, since they did not feel a correlation with them, and since they did not understand their worth.

...that`s true...but that had nothing to do with hating Assyrians..it had to do with hating idols...something they learned form your common parent, the Hebrews..they destroyed most of India as well...amazing treasures gone in a flash...no one said these religions were anything but destructive. That was then..and I`ll remind you that Protestants took off after art and treasures too..and threw them to the streets and burned them..and Christians ravaged the treasures of the New World...they put a match to the gorgeous train of Moctezuma made entirely of hummingbird feathers..it was over TWENTY yards long and glistened in the sun like madness.

..Before this war the Iraqis...who are NOT the kinds of fanatics you are refering to..the kind who are NOW in power thanks to Christians...the Iraqis took exceptional care and pride in all their treasures..among which they most definitely count the ancients..as they have every right to do.
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>>**********If Assyrians chose to become Muslim and leave the ancient Assyrian Religion, why blame Assyrian converts to Christianity who would rather just marry one wife?
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>...Muhammad`s provision that you marry as many wives as you can support has less to do with lust than you people like to imagine. The practical reality is that in male dominated cultures where women cannot work or stand alone, they either marry or become whores. Death was everywhere present and wars would leave women with no one to care for their children...I have no doubt the majority of women would have preferred to be able to work and own property, as Khadijeh was able to do...at a time when NO Christian woman...east OR west could.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Ancient Egyptian and Assyrian women also owned property. I never denied that Rome created a patriarchal Christianity which gives power to the man.

...we are talking about the middle age...long after the ancients.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ When God was a WOMAN thousands of years ago...there was peace on earth..........until the goddess fell and man took her place….and look what happened.

...you get no argument from me on that...the saddest day for all of us was when man enshrined his little prick.
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>..there is very little "lust" in Muslim society..as you can see by how harshly they treat prositution..which isn`t right either because they still offer little oportunity to women to do much else..and lady, MOST wives ARE whores...they give sex and work for money....and put up with louts they would under NO circumstances allow in their beds or homes if economic necessity didn`t impel them...you might reflect on the hordes of prostitutes surrounding St Peters and the absence of any in Mecca.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ God help women... ….yes well… it was men who prostitute the woman, maybe because SHE is of a more divine nature. Notice what Jesus said about females….he did have a lot of respect for them.

...and why do you keep referencing Jesus..have you something against Assyrians? Do you think they tolerated prositution and it took Jesus to show mercy? The code of Hammurabi is the SOURCE of the concept of Mercy in the ancient world..it sure as hell wasn`t the Herews Jesus came from..his ancestor david was a tyhug, a highwayman, a robber and gang leader of cutthroats who turned on his friends and those loyal to himregularly..he sent his faithful Uriah to his death deliberately so he could screw Bathsheeba...and this is the lineage you prefer to that of the noble Assyrians?
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>>But they also live in a real world and when Christian neighbors of theirs have betrayed them for the promises of foreign co-religionists, Muslims get mightily pissed..as anyone would.
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>>*********** Well …..have they not done the same to Assyrians with their co-religionists?
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>...you have to address the questions put to you first before asking another...
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>What choices do we have? If we were safe, and could practice our Religion without discrimination in our homeland, and if we had equal rights, we would not have to try to get in with other “coalitions.”
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>...name the restrictions placed upon you and practicing your religion.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ One restriction is that our language is not considered one of the official languages of Iraq

..as Navajo isn`t an official language of the United States..as Apache isn`t...as Chirikawa isn`t..as Cherokee isn`t....a few years ago a law was passed in California saying that people whose first language is Spanish MUST NOT speak that language while at work with co-workers..that English is the official language..have you heard ONE Mexican crying?

......we are persecuted because we are Christians...eg the killing of nuns...old ones.... who had done NOTHING WRONG TO MUSLIMS.

...how many? And how many Iraqi children have been killed THIS time around? Is it the same with you..one Christian nun is worth ten thousand children?


..they were innocent souls.... as I’m sure there have been innocent souls killed on the Muslim side too... it's insane…

...Christians in America kill Christians in America all the time..in fact no one has killed more Christians THAN Christians...why do you not rant and rave over the Christian children killed by Christians in Iraq...why this fixation on Muslims? And there are plenty of churches in Baghdad where Christians have been practising their religion just fine..and you can bet the United States blew those churches up...not to mention all the mosques blown up...in this war it is the Christians who are the criminals...Muslims are defending themselves as best they can..it is insane to expect things to improve for Christians now...

...you mean THOSE are your examples of "persecution"???
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>Do you think our co-religionists give a damn about us anyway? They “care” just as our “co-religionists” stood by and watched as we were slaughtered in Simele.
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>...agreed. At bottom the West doesn`t consider you Christians anyway..especially not the born-again branch.
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>>We unfortunately are a week Nation..with only very few true leaders … and of many enemies, and if we had any brains we would UNITE and work for the future of our Nation and the children of Assyria.
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>...you have no enemies...but yourselves...no one stopped the Shumirum but our Christians..no Turk or Kurd or Arab...just "Assyrians". You are also not a nation. You also have no brains..I don`t mean you personally...I mean what you refer to as a nation and a People..these are nothing more than the Christian sects that were tearing BetNahrain apart when the Muslims arrived..and thank your god they came or else the Byzantines would have conquered you and they would have killed each and every last one of you..unless you converted. Show a little gratitude.
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>@@@@@@ Well......it is SELFISH to stop the Shumirum from going up. I am not one to hand out compliments, it is not my nature.. but I personally feel very proud to know that a statue of Ashurbanipal is standing somewhere, ANYWHERE. You did that.

...we did that.
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>@@@@@@Maybe she will go up in Iraq sometime in the memory of the two lady's she represents.

..that would be wonderful...I can`t imagine a single Iraq protesting....but I CAN imagine "Assyrians" around us howling.
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>@@@@ I have too much brain for my own good. I remember being 17 or 18 years old and having a similar conversation with you at beth, and I didn't do a bad job stating my case either! =)

..you do a greaqt job...your only problem is that what you call your beliefs are shallow...you are making the case for others...others who happened to be blood enemies of the Assyrians...when you find your Assyrian center...you will be formidable indeed...but then you and I won`t have much to argue about...but maybe with a few others we can begin to exhume our Assyrian ancestry.
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>@@@@ When I say my Nation I mean the idealized Assyria, and to be honest I do not feel an affinity with many of my people, rather I feel the affinity with my ancestors. They were more profound.

...then promote them more..there is no one else who will do it...jesus Inc has tons of reps out there pounding the sidewalks...who speaks out for the people of Ashur...Ken Doll?
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>>*********** It is amazing to watch one of my proff’s this semester.. in a course i’m taking about ancient Egypt….the land of KHEM. She so passionately calls the Assyrians “INVADERS” into Egypt, to drill that point into the students heads... Assyrians =Invaders, in her little mind. When she gets to the Greeks she softly says they were “conquerors.” She almost had a heart attack when I said that some scholars have suggested that the builder of Memphis (capital of Egypt for a long time) was the son of Sargon.... Damn some of these “historians” …they make up their own history and are so passionate about it too..and then she giggles and says...well I guess I have my biases...ya so obvious!
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>...skin her alive!!!
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>> Muhammad did NOT tell them to turn any cheeks..if Christians of that region wished to live and practise their religion in peace, as they were doing UNTIL this recent Crusade...there was no problem...but, if they played fast and loose..as for instance by aligning themselves with foreign Christians, then they could expect reprisals...as Americans would punish any Americans who listened to a foreign power
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>>********** What to do Mr. Parhad? Tell us what should Assyrian Christians have done?
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>...they should have been content to do as the one fellow says they do in Syria today and did in Iraq till now...if their religion and THEIR worship of it is so important..then they can go ahead for no one ever bothered them..BUT, when those same bishops and priests, who have been jockeying for power and position since before the Muslim conquest..teach you to or lead you to or take sides themselves with foreign Christians because they hope to be the BIGGEST dick on the block..then you will ALL suffer...nothing surprising in that.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@ They should get priests married. I think they are so disconnected from themselves, and the source of life, let alone Jesus... that they become lunatics and tyrants, especially when they were never true spiritual people to start with. I SAY LET WOMEN BECOME PRIESTS ALSO...they could show men a thing or two about spirituality...and GET those PRIESTs MARRIED FOR GODS SAKE.

...I agree...women would do a much beter job.
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>There is nothing at all in Islam for any Christian to hate or refuse to accept..obviously not as many of our Assyrians went to it easily enough...and as Islam has willing converts all over the world and in Europe...certainly they were not forced under the sword to become Muslim. Your version of their religion is as much a cartoon as the lower classes of Muslims feel towards Christianity..that`s been the danger in holding yourselves apart..it meant you people stayed at the lowest end of society where the most ignorant dwell...sort of like forming your opinion of all Christians based on the hillbillies of Appalachia...or Pat Robertson..enough of this...grow up and grow OUT.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Well I think Abu Bakar had some great thoughts...and surely there are many things in the Koran worth reading. My vision of their religion is that you know the religion by its fruit...and look what Islam is doing. They behead people like they cut a tomatoes, with no mercy. I'm not saying that other countries aren't doing the same. Two wrongs don't make a right.

..there again you do Christianity`s work for it...by slamming only Muslims...we execute mentally retarded people...you should read sometime the prolonged agony of dying by lethal injection...or in the gas chamber or electric chair...or you should think about a nation whose officials say it is alright to starve to death 5000 children a month for 14 years...try it sometime...think as an Assyrian and you might think even deeper.
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>>>It is a miracle that we have survived, even as Assyrian Christians.
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>>...do you really call THIS survival?
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>>************* Well, when I went to the last convention I quietly questioned myself on THIS too, but there were and are a few bright lights which make even THIS worthy of the term survival.
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>...I agree...I have met a few myself..but a few won`t do...we need far more and nothing in Christianity is going to inspire them to anything more than praying even more fervently and weeping more profusely..it`s time to pick up the banner of our ancient ancestors once again...it`s still there...I can see it clearly...this exile into Christianity doesn`t have to be the last word...we had other periods in our ancient history when we were attacked and overrun...but we weathered the storm and grew stronger for it...BUT, we will not grow stronger, "in Christ"...we will only grow stronger in Ashur.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Tell us about your Ashur...what does he say? What is his message? What if Christ, Ashur, Krishna, Budha are all just aspects of God? Don’t you think that the Truth can be reached through many roads? Of course God sent messengers from the beginning…… Do you not think the Dalai Lama is a messenger of God?

...I am as much a messenger of god as they are or you are..you will know a god by what he or she or it inspired in those who profess to believe...believing in what Ashur expects of us makes me able to keep on truckin...whether I make it up or really feel it, doesn`t matter...it only matters what you DO....goodness hardly ever comes from a bad core.
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>>True, we are somewhat lost, but at least we are trying to find our ancient identity once again.
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>>...I see no evidence of that either...the ancient Assyrians have value to modern "Assyrians" ONLY for the "sacrifice" they made to Judaism..that`s it!
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>>********** I was speaking of myself, and many of the Assyrian youths from Europe who are embracing their ancient Identity along with Christianity. Especially the Suryoye- Othoroye of Europe who are ahead of all others in this regard.
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>..that`s good to hear...but the two don`t go together..if you believe in monotheism you have to choose..you can`t belong to TWO gods...you can`t be a follower of Ashur AND Christ...and if you are a Pagan and proud of it..if you allow all people their gods and ask them to do the same for you...you can be Assyrian and RESPECT the Christian god..but you know which one comes FIRST.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ I believe in one God with many messengers. No one has ever seen or talked to God. The burning bush you say? That was not God. I am that I am...it was just an angel..... God is too pure and vast a concept for us to understand or comprehend. And it is probably a SHE. =)

...this one god business is the prelude to all this hatred and murder..it is madness personified..of COURSE there are more than one god...look around you...when people believed in many they were more tolerant of all...this one god nonsense has us killing each other for that ONE god.
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>>(I can only speak for myself) The Coptic Church inherited and amalgamated much of the ancient Egyptian traditions when they became Christians,
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>>...what are you refering to as "Egyptian"? Many things in Egyptian paganism impressed Plato and he designed most of early Christianity.
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>>********Yes, Plato…. quite a guy….the Allegory of the Cave..my favorite …
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>...so much of Christianity is Greek and Egyptian and Assyrian..and so LITTLE of it is Hebrew EXCEPT for that madman of a god and child and human ritual sacrifice...ugh!
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>@@@@@@@@@@@ See, exactly..... So much of the Old Testament is the whole worlds culture, not just the Hebews. They just took all the history of the world and changed everyone’s name and made it their own. Jesus was trying to reinstate the old ways………………….which they had lost…

...again with the Hebrews and their Jesus...why do you spend so much time talking about Jesus? Where is your interest in anything LIVING that is purely Assyrian today? The Hebrews did not write the Bible...Rome did. The Old Testicles has nothing Greek in it...it is pure bloodlust and pure Hebrew...the New testicles borrowed but only to direct it all back to Rome. Rome decided what Christianity would be, not Jesus.
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>>so the Assyrians also kept some of their Assyrian traditions through Christianity.
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>>...name one. Name one that is NOT church tradition FIRST. And name one that ONLY Christian "Assyrians" practise.
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>>******** Ok, I’ll name one --LANGUAGE. Although the ancient Assyrians spoke Akkadian, and wrote with the cuneiform writing system on clay tablets, they did eventually adopt the Aramaic system of writing, way before Christianity ever appeared on the scene, and although they used the Aramaic script, much of the ancient Assyrian, Akkadian, language was still being used. Kind of like the Coptic language which used Greek letters for writing, although the words were ancient Egyptian. Like I in Arabic could write to you in English letters, Shu.. Keefak, keef sahtak .. leish m3asib?!
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>...that language was used by everyone back then..it proves nothing..it is not uniquely and exclusively Assyrian..it isn`t EVEN Assyrian properly speaking but was adopted by them from the Arameans...language is something anyone can learn..it proves nothing.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Yes, I can learn Chinese today if I would like too. My point was that we speak the closest language to the ancient Assyrian language TODAY, and we have preserved this language. e.g. we did not let go of our language and start speaking Arabic only.

..only because of your church...which is Jewish in origin..and the Jews spoke the language as well. In America..where the liturgy is in English...your "Assyrians" no longer speak and will less and less...so...are they no longer Assyrians?

The Scriptures helped us in this regard, and it was through Christianity and the Church that our language stayed alive. I am no Church advocate by any means, and I think Marx was right when he said, “religion is the opiate of the masses” but not true Religion……. when one person feels a connection with the spiritual realm/God………organized religion is the problem..…. if you have violent behavior you know that you are doing something wrong…anyone who acts violently is not a spiritual person….even if that person claims to be a descendant of Abgar……….wise as serpents but harmless as doves was the advice………
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>>*****SO, we Assyrian-Christians, have preserved an evolved form of Akkadian, that we still speak to this day, and this of course was an ancient tradition before it later became a church tradition.
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>..like I said, everyone spoke that language and as you can see today, less and less of you speak it..is it THAT easy to be rid of Assyrians? It matters more what you DO in a language than what you say...several Jews don`t speak their language, but they have contributed mightily to Israel AND to the cutlure of the world...enobling their People and Heritage...what have we done...DONE, in our language...but beg and cry?
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>@@@@@@@@@@@ It is true that one can contribute to his or her Nation without speaking the language, but you had asked about a similarity between modern and ancient Assyrians, and language is a pivotal factor in any nations identity.

...this is not a nation.
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>@@@@@@@@@The Jews are more secure in their identity, because theirs is built on much firmer ground, because they chose it TWICE, once when they left Mesopotamia, and once again after their exodus into Europe.........Hek they sold their identity to Europeans, and they bought it, creating the new Israel….although maybe not the New Jerusalem.
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>> they adopted Christianity, and they kept their language alive through Christianity.
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>...they could have kept it on becomming Muslim..it was their choice..like they can keep it today on becoming American, but let it go...being Christian only "saved" it because it happened to be the liturgical language...which it became because the Jews, who were the first and probably ONLY Christians there, spoke the same language...so really the Jews saved it.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@ We spoke the same language because we were the same people, as Sitchin says. Unfortunately time, geography, and history have made us not able to recognize the similarities we share. Who the hell cares if we say Shalom, Shlama, or Salam.......I don't, and if all sides could adapt that kind of mentality, I would not complain....Hell the Assyrians can’t get along because one says shlama, and the other shlomo….. it is psychotic.

...because we have no center and core..we lost it..the Jews didn`t.
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>>I’m not saying that all Assyrians are Christian, and that all Christians are Assyrians either. We have lost our true identity as a Nation, but I believe there are individuals who have found a balance of both.
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>>...of course..that may be. But if that is true, those individuals would lean to the side of the boat that is exclusively Assyrian with NO semblance of Christianity to it...Christians are in every wide spot in the road..they are crawling between heaven and earth like a plague..they are murdering people everywhere they can find the slightest excuse or none at all, excpe they WANT to..and just remember that there wouldn`t even BE any Christianity if NOT for murder..for that initial murder you all celebrate by eating the flesh and drinking the blood, for play and "make-believe", of your first and most innocent victim...Christianity is SAFE.....and doing very well and in no danger or need of any further stroking or care..it is the REST of us, Assyrians included, who are in danger of being run over and into the ground by it...therefore let those who "feel" at all Assyrian...work for the Assyrian Heritage for a change...and you can all start by throwing Nimrod out a window...anything above four storeys would do.
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>>***** If you read Gnostic scriptures you would know about what Jesus said to his apostles about the nature of his suffering……
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>...I`m not taking anyone`s word for what Jesus said...he is to be found inside of you if anywhere...needs no interpreters. He was more an example than a bunch of statements attributed to him by others..none of which were that unique in their own day. He believed strongly what other`s just mouthed and paid the price...as has happened to countless people...many of whom are sitting in jail today. That he took the risk he did is what makes him special...not the beatitudes and the rest of the words stuffed into his dead mouth to serve Rome`s interests.
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>@@@@@@@@@@ Well some say he traveled to Tibet... so who knows...maybe an ISSA had passed that way…………
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>before he was crucified…so that they would not go into shock….this part was of course cut out of the Bible because it involved magic and somewhat occult behavior… the apostles standing in a circle singing with Jesus in the middle chanting numbers and words which the disciples answered with AMEN… ….or maybe not…Muslims say he was not crucified. and of course you know that Muslims believe that Jesus was a prophet also.
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>...while Christians believe Muhammad was a pervert.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@ Well, I do not know if he was a pervert....but he was not of the divine nature Jesus was of ...and he does not originate or belong on any winged disk.

..the man inspired countles people...he died in bed surrounded by friends and family...no Muslim needed to have him scalped.
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>>************I know that there is no need to choose between Ashur and Jesus. I know and believe that Krishna was also an aspect of God….I am no extremist…and understand the nature of “doctrines”…The Koran didn’t fall down from heaven either..as is believed….. I don’t care for heaven…..if it exists fine..if it doesn’t... whatever….and no one can sell me a ticket to get up there. I know that my soul is everlasting, and I don’t need any priest to be my connection to God. When I am taking a walk, and am bored I speak to Him or more probably Her, and you know what…many people have religious experiences… I had one when I was four years old… I beat out Mani who had one when he was twelve!
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>>
>>>Did you know that some Jewish Scholars believe and claim that Christianity =Assyrian?
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>>...Jews can do what they want...everyone can rent a house by the sea and live happily ever after...for my part I know Christianity has reduced us to mush and is about to wipe us off the face of the earth...either as corpses or as terminal mush. My center of gravity and focus has NOTHUING to do with what Jews or their blood brothers the Christians have to say...I know when Ashur would be pleased and I know when he is saddened....where you all EVER got the idea that a Messiah or Deliverer was EVER any part of our heritage I can`t figure out. Christianity has made you all NEED one...that`s been its "gift" to you.
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>>********* I agree with you that we need to become born again Assyrians by learning about our history and our TRUE IDENTITY….but for me that does not mean we have to get rid of our Christian roots.. I told you … Jesus on the winged disk…it’s great…. Did he not float away on a “cloud” and won’t he be coming back in a “cloud”??? Ashur and Jesus are pals…
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>...no. Not in today`s world we are forced to live in and duck for our lives. In some perfect place..a garden of your choosing, perhaps..but your affinity for Jesus is being used against you and against the interests of many innocent people...including those of BetNahrain..if Jesus were alive today he would damn Christians and refuse to have anything to do with his own cult.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Yes.. I also dream of that Utopia or the new Atlantis, but we are in purgatory my friend.... the physical world, survival of the fittest it seems...fallen angels...this place is an ilussion…....no space..

..life is what you make of it...there have been hard times always, nothing new...it is only those who had unrealistic expectations who later turn on all dreams and effort.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@ Maybe he will just come back on that cloud with Ashur and the gang and destroy the cult, that temple of Satan, that Evil Dragon.

...Ashur never went anywhere...we left.
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>...When you are in the same car with a gang who murders the people in a store it robs..even if you are asleep or praying at the time and had NO knowledge of what they planned..you are as guilty as they are of murder...the Law would tell you that you had better KNOW what kind of people you`re getting into a car with..what they`re capable of..it is YOUR responsibility...ignorance is no excuse for breaking the Law...a citizen is expected to know the laws of the land they dwell in...likewise you have an obligation to see what is being done in the name of this Jesus...doesn`t matter how "wrong" your gang is..of COURSE they`re wrong..that`s the whole POINT. And for you to willingly associate with them..makes you a partner in their crimes...as are all of us as human beans when humans commit these crimes...so let`s all stop belonging to gangs and form a civilization for a change.
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>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ We are all in the same car, it's called the earth.. =) And yes there are murderers, and people who rob stores, and people who destroy peoples careers.....do we blame innocent people of their crimes, just because we live on the same planet? NO!

..you are not innocent if you are in the car...we are all guilty to some extent, but Christians more so.
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>>
>>>Back to Natives….I have personally always believed that the Native people, in their own religion, as many of the ancient religions, knew much more about the true spirit of Christianity. Some churches have become businesses, NGO's, and although there is a spiritual side also, they do not share with us the truth of our religion, because they cannot bear to tell the world that they lied to us. And yes they did lie, and keep many of the secrets to themselves because they do not want to share it with the “common man”.
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>>...Christianity was IMPOSED on people..their own values, spirituality, culture, legends, myths, rituals...the entire SOUP they and their ancestors were raised in and developed painstakingly since Time began for them was wiped out by the Christian armies who converted them...the rest of you, the Eastern ones, I`m not convinced aren`t just the first descendants of those earliest Jewish converts to Christianity. I don`t believe for a minute that there were millions and millions of you in pagan countries..that pagans who never heard of that minor cult, which is all it was in its day, threw away their magnificant civilizations at the MENTION of Jesus and his father..just don`t buy it...especially when all we have to go by is the word of that same dubious, lying, self-serving preisthood of scoundrels...
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>>**********Assyrians were the first to adopt Christianity. No one forced us… it was a very natural processfor us.. …temples to the god SIN…turned into temples to Jesus….
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>>********Europeans imposed Christianity on other Nations…yes..for sure.. but Assyrians willingly became Christian..although I’m not sure why exactly they became Catholic. I was born a Catholic ..no offence……….. it just bothers me that Churches are splitting our nation today…that everyone seems brainwashed… lost our true identity….and that priests are allowed to play politics.
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>>...and yet. where we DO have ample and unbiased accounts...in the OTHER half of the world, we can SEE how people were murdered into Christianity...therefore logic alone, if nothing else, as well as some bare appreciation for human psychology, tells us that it is not possible that the same religion that people refused to surrender their ways, for unto death...in one place...that being HALF of the world..is the SAME religion we are to believe people LEAPT into in the OTHER part of the world...especially when you add that the people we know to have been murdered into it had not the vast and far richer cultures, than the ones we are expected to believe jumped into Jesus..leaving behind all the Assyrian, Babylonian, Persian and other high cultures..it is a lie... and so improbable that, of course, you must take it on "faith"..in other words, render yourself stupid enough to believe just about anything.
>>
>>********* Yes it does seem that our Christianity is of a very different nature then the other kinds. Therefore, logic tells us that they are not the same religion..just the same supposed name. If two brothers…twins perhaps live their life and one becomes a murderer and the other a saint, do we judge the saint by the actions of the murderer?
>>
>>********* Now by no means do I mean all of Assyrians have adopted the True Spirit of Christianity. Most of them believe everything that is sold to them wholesale…everything the Church says must be true, and they have also been brainwashed. All they know is some Church songs (although beautiful) which they repeat, but they do not search to find the True Voice of Jesus. Then again maybe knowing a few simple things is to know the True Voice of Jesus...who knows... I am entitled to my point of view! I am trying to give a voice for the True Spirit of Christianity which does not preach murder..and hell .....maybe I do not even understand Christ....
>>
>>...The Pagans the earliest Christians settled among TOLERATED you people because that was ever the pagan way in BetNahrain where ALL gods were welcome, tolerated and respected...because the ancients knew the gods of a People kept them whole and sane and together and able to contribute their best..and also kept them happy enough to accept the turns and twists of fate...enduring loss and hardship in hope of being restored by their gods one day..it was in everyone`s interests to respect the other persopn`s gods because the next time around today`s master could be tomorrow`s slave...that Assyrian Golden Rule at work.
>>
>>***********We were not Pagans…. You are using a European term which they labeled us with, as they accused the Egyptians of believing in a zillion gods…which is not true… Monotheism existed of course long before the Hebrews came along. If our scirputres were so “pagan” why did the hebrews they use the Enuma Elish to create Genesis? Our Gods became their Nefilim..
>>
>>************ A Sumerian proverb… He who seeks Truth generates life. We can all make up stories….and write “history”….the Truth though is Living….and herstory would have been much more accurate.
>>
>>...But..being tolerated alone is not enough for pain-in-the-ass EVANGELICALS! Merely being allowed to worship PRIVATELY as they see fit, won`t do for those who believe it is their DUTY to bang on your door at midnight and tell you all about themselves. And that was at the core of any "persecution" you people brought on YOURSELVES. You were NEVER "massacreed"...for heavin`s sake...especially not for being "Assyrian". You were roundly hated at times..but that`s understandable and forgiveable..hell, you hate EACH OTHER!!!
>>
>>****** I don’t hate anyone..even those who think I hate them…
>>
>>..You can see how insular those people are still..what they do to a daughter or son who marries a foreigner..a non-Christian...or even a Christian who is not "Assyrian"..and that`s TODAY! For all those centuries and millenia you lived among Muslims and pagans too..you intermarried like crazy...inbreeding your ways to an Aprim and Jassim...genetic dingbats if there ever were any...your numbers in the MidEast reflect exactly what would happen if 500 Jew converts to Christianity screwed only each other for 2000 years...that is all. It`s a lie that people from all over RAN and JUMPED into Jesus. For the love of all that is really holy, THINK sometimes!
>>
>>****** I do think, “therefore I am” Descartes
>>
>>
>>Check out Gnostic scriptures sometime. Jesus did not want to be portrayed as a weak, beaten down God, dieing on a cross, and through his death all sins would disappear, making us feel guilty about breathing….no that is not Jesus..and yes he even danced….and had a occult magical side to him…..and he would have looked more in his place on the winged disk, as Ashur, and Zoroaster etc....
>>
>>...a wonderful guy no doubt...he and I would have been great pals and would have laughed many a time over the antics of "Christians"...and I would have REFUSED point blank to "benefit from his willing sacrifice". But there was love and kindness and nobility and majesty and self-sacrifice and honesty and respect for elders and joy in children well BEFORE Jesus. Your ten commandments are nothing but Hammurabi`s Code, (garbled and chopped up, as those people never could do a damn thing right)....and most of all in BetNahrain, where the highest civilization of its day was gracing the landscape when Jesus wasn`t even thought of..it is a great insult to tell us our ancestors were bloody savages who`s greatest act EVER was to realize they were mistaken all along..as Ken Doll says Muslims told him THEY have been...and dumped Ashur for the "values" of Christianity...Christianity is NOT about love and kindness...I mean how much more do you have to see of it before that becomes OBVIOUS? It is certainly crystal clear to those at the other end of the barrel of Christian Love. All Christianity is, is the belief that if you accept Jesus being killed for YOU...you can get his clothes..and his clothes will get you unbelievable goodies..that`s ALL! And, to join the gang...you HAVE to eat his flesh and drink his blood and feed this gore to your darling and trusting babies! And WE Assyrians were savages???!!!
>>
>>********** Yes a wonderful soul. And you probably are great pals…you just keep it secret. I would have also refused….. and yes there was love and kindness and nobility before…I am not much for “commandments” either…they are not detailed enough…. And commandments don't work for me… I have to be .asked....nicely…friendly advice would have been better....or by example..as Jesus did.
>>
>>****** Well …symbolism is hard to understand…and the rituals were symbolic.

...what would you think of a "symbolic" ritual depicting pederasty? Certainly that is as illegal and frowned upon as cannibalism and vampirism...would you accept the explanation that it was "just a symbol" when a priest of such a cult held aloft a bagel...said it was a little boys asshole...and "pretended to enter it...also with a "symbol" of his prick? Do you see any harm in such a "symbol" when young children must confront such a thing...with their smiling parents nearby to explain that it`s only a "symbol" of perfect love? Symbols are chosen for a REASON..they don`t just happen...why these two and why NOT pederasty?
>>>
>>>Rome is the church of power. When they attacked the Natives, they didn't care about the true spirit of Christianity. All they hungered for was gold, and expanding the Christianity of Rome, as they did to us when they divided our Nation… a never-ending dilemma which has crippled and is crippling our Nation today.
>>
>>..the true spirit of Christianity IS bloodshed..it IS theft! It is killing people if they refuse YOUR god...for no other reason BUT that! It is murderous intolerance...I can`t see why you keep looking for the good in something that`s had 2000 years to get it right...and HAS!!! Look at it. And yet, you have so little interest in anything Assyrian that is NOT primarily Christian first!
>>
>>********* The True Spirit of Christianity is Jesus… who did he ever kill? In his name people were killed….yes....…but not by his command or in his instructions…

...and he was killed BY CHRISTIANS...by the Rome that would go on and make his corpse pay...and no Christian today would have done anything to stop his being murdered...who wants to give up on their chance to go to heaven..and you don`t get there just by being good and Christlike...you have to ACCEPT murder..and be part of the gang AFTER the fact..which STILL makes you criminaly liable on earth...which is where we are.
>>
>>********* I am very interested in everything Assyrian, whether it is Christian or not. I just happen to see a connection with Assyrianism and Christianity . He was “before Abraham”….. =) Assyrian, Akkadian, Sumerian??????

..Abraham was a sick fuck we threw out of Nineveh so he could go peddle his wife, Sarai, as his sister to a variety of men...while his brother Lot fucked his own daughters, after disposing of their mother in the desert..these are your saints?
>>
>>...had Christ been saved and spared his execution not a ONE of you could get your Heaven...what kind of an improvement is that over what the Assyrians had? The benefits of ritual human sacrifice..that`s ALL Hebrew religion was..and that`s at the core of Christianity..which is nothing more than a major sect of Judaism....where in Ashur`s name is there ANYTHING for an Assyrian in that? We come from a background that MADE a heaven on earth...only you had to be worthy of it yourself HERE...not up there soemwhere and not on the wings of a corpse...the belief in an afterlife is a consolation prize for Hebrews and those who have been MADE into Hebrews...it is the belief that someone will conme someday to wipe your nose...something you haven`t the power to do yourself..because the Jews were powerless under the Roman yoke. What else COULD they have believed?
>>
>>********** Yes and Muslims get 50 virgins in Heaven… I guess they have a certain “heaven” in mind … funny thing is the Ancient Assyrians also had a heaven…and they were obsessed with the heavens…that is why many of them were Astrologers……

..their heaven was merely a dark and shadowy place..they filled it with nothing and didn`t bother with it...Muslim heaven at least has things in it which we know some people ENJOY..whereas your heaven has everyone singing off key for eternity and staring at a face...things NO ONE wants to do for ten minutes on earth.
>>
>>********* By the way, I study Astrology as a hobby…and it is very much not a Christian thing to do. Give me your birth date I’ll do your birth chart. I don’t know why but I think you might be a Scorpio…Leo...or.maybe Gemini?????

...Cancer..and it`s been done several times by people also curious as to what planet I come from.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>No one sect of Christianity is the true Christianity, and I don't mean to criticize Roman Catholics who have truly embraced Christianity. I’m sure they have many true believers, but it doesn’t matter what sect of Christianity a person “belongs” to. It is up to the individual to live in a Christian way, or not, (freedom of choice, free will).
>>
>>...living in a Christian way is what got us here..it is what led to the rounding up and murder of millions of totally innocent human beans..NOT 1000 years ago but 60 years ago...and it is today embarking on its next great mission...the murder of Islam where just as many people and children will be murdered..this is the real Christian way. You are like the shocked and horrified daughter, sent away to finishing school in Europe, who learns what the family business REALLY is..and tries to lead an exemplary personal life..to atone for the famiglia and in hopes of cleaning up their name..you are a daughter of a Mafia Clan..one of the most deadly and viscious the world has ever seen...you happen to have been born into it though you don`t personally follow their practises...but honey, you help clear their name! You and all the rest of you "nice people" are JUST what the head Don needs..you`re the ones who can be counted on to explain away every crime and murder and theft...by asking for "understanding" or "forgiveness"...and pointing over to where your cousins stand..heads respectfully lowered, because they got caught...the guns and blood still dripping from their hands and ask for another chance for these wayward but dear fellows who are trying AWFULLY hard to be good...and it works every time and the hoods are let loose and they do it all over again..and again..and again..and just as surely..as if it was a PART of the entire family business, YOU appear again to plead for some respect and tolerance for your murderous crew.
>>
>>**** I never plead, it is not my way…nor the Assyrian way…and I would rather die then beg….. And those you describe are not Christians, and I am not part of any Mafia Clan either….I’m a Catholic turned Gnostic…and a Assyrian soon to turn Mandean..jk…. look.. I’m HUMAN…. and I do not accept the killing of any humans…including Muslims…but I also do not accept them killing people of my Nation, who have never forcibly converted anyone…and have in the last century been literally crucified…..

..they have not...they enjoyed peace and quiet in Turkey...as much as any plave the three religions lived side by side..you people fight and gouge each other`s eyes out and you are all Christians..it is more than understandable therefore that living among Muslims and Jews there would be more of ther same...that was all shattered the first time the Western Christians came looking for oil..attacking another country that hadn`t done a THING to them...but have oil..the same oil they`re killing for now...THAT was what ruined it for them..that and the Armenians who believed England would help them and our own Agha Poutrous who took up arms on behalf of the British...had any Muslims living in America done such athing not a one of them would have survived..and then they came BACK and trusted the British again barely a few years later and got Simele for their pains..and today they`re at it again...I`d say you people have a death wish as big as most arses in your nation..it is madness to side with foreign pwers when there is a war on..or even the hint of one..it is called Treason and the United States would SHOOT you without a care if you became "Levies" for a foreign occupier...your peop,e ahve NOT been massacreed or persecuted..they have received what anyone gets, regardless of religion, who does what they do..today the Iraqis are killing ANYONE suspected of aiding and abetting the foreign attackers...as is natural and right. Every time one of you gets arrested for stealing from a store you holler, "THEY ARE TAKING A CHRISTIAN TO JAIL"!!
>>
>>*****In this physical world…it seems we were born to kill or be killed………… it’s all that guys fault who put Adam and Eve together in the garden and then left them alone. Well WHAT THE HELL DID YOU THINK THEY WERE GOING TO DO?
>>
>>****** I do not want to go to heaven…all I ask of God is when I reincarnate it should be in a dimension where we are spirit and not matter.
>>
>>..it is an inspired partnership.
>>>
>>>
>>>Many Iraqi-Muslims of today were probably once Akkadians, Sumerians, Babylonians, and maybe even Assyrians, but they were forced to, or have consciously left their ancient identity, and although I have met many of them who claim to be of these ancestries, the majority claim they are Arabs.
>>
>>...this is old stuff by now and means nothing to the point. They can say whatever they want..as you people can..it doesn`t make a BetBassoo out of a Jassim...you people place your everything on talk and names. Muslim Assyrians have 1,400 years of proud and magnificent history as MUSLIMS...the term "Arab" is something you throw around..or, it is the more recent attempt to form a united front to counter the united front of European Christianity..which is also many various groups..same as with "Arab". Arabs themselves..as late as the early 1900s had no concept of an "Arab"...they knew of no such country...only of their tribal lands...this is getting old.
>>
>>******* Islam =Arab=Arab Religion=Arab Language.
>>>
>>>What is a Nationality anyway? Were the Jewish people not from Mesopotamia? Did they not leave their homeland, and establish a whole new identity?
>>
>>...you are referring to a People who KEPT their miserable little god..while you are all THRILLED to have dumped your magnificent one..there is a world of difference.
>>
>>********** Their god was not a miserable little god… he was Jealous and violent..lethal combination!
>>
>>>
>>>Identity and Nationality is a complicated matter.
>>
>>...made uninteligible by Aprim and the rest of the nationalists.
>>
>>********* When will you be writing a book?
>>>
>>>I wish you and your family well.
>>
>>..thanks...same to you.
>>
>>…danke
>>>
>>>Abbey
>>
>>...as in church?
>>.
>>…In English…...Yes..church....the Abbey…but in the True Spirit of Christ not the fake one bought and sold with gold..… My name is really Abir …an Arabic name..... These Alqoshites…they give us Arabic names instead of calling me Inanna.
>>
>>
>>Leaving on a light note. A tribal joke.
>>
>>************There was an Assyrian from Tyare who teamed up with a Suryoyo-Othoroyo, trying to convince three Chaldeans and one Aramean to become Assyrian. One of the Chaldeans was from Alqosh, the other from Aradin, and the last one from Tilkef. The Aramean was from Syria. The two double team Tyaraya and Othoroye give them all a lectures on the matter of Assyrianism, and they (the four being lectured) interested enough go out and search for their ancient identity. They read the words of their ancestors and are passionately convinced. A few months later they are conversing with the Assyrian and the Othoroye about their ancient history etc… and they happen to have read so much that the two cannot even keep up with their newfound knowledge. In anger …..the Assyrian screams out, “but YOU are not the REAL Assyrians ...I AM”. The Othoroye on the other hand smiles in is overjoyed that he gained four brothers.
>
>@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ You did not answer the interesting comments...like did I guess your zodiac right?

...see ya in the funny papers...



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