The Inside Assyria Discussion Forum #5

=> Re: Just Kidding...

Re: Just Kidding...
Posted by Toma Deekis Hariri (Guest) - Saturday, May 26 2007, 21:25:21 (CEST)
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pancho wrote:

>...The Jews are a speacial case because of one thing: they kept faith with their ancient religion and its holy books and laws. Had Assyrians done that, no matter their hair color, they could claim to be Assyrians today...but they didn't do that.
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The person making the claim has to prove it...especially when there isn't a single Assyrian "thing" the modern Assyrians do...if the Christians of Iraq claim to be Assyrian, no one has to do anything to "prove them wrong"...it is THEY who have to prove their case...and they can't...and never have been able to...and for this reason no one in that region accepts the claim...it isn't because they hate you...or refuse to believe for some secret and strange reason..it's because they know where this and when this came from...it is absurd....especially wyhen you claim that to be Assyrian a person MUST be Christian..or MUST do or say what you think they should....but...since it doesn't matter anywhere, no one wants the headache of proving you "wrong"..they just pat you on the head and move on...in the Christian west they make a big deal over your claism because they are interested in you as a potential fifth column...to be used...that's all.
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TDH: To my knowledge, Akitu/Kha'b nissan originate from the Assyrian culture. Some may say that is a recently "resurrected" holiday that was forgot about, which is fine then you can disregard it if you want. Then what about "Nusar'dil" (water sprinkling/throwing thingamajigee type holiday)? How about "Baa'oota Ninwaye" (Ninevite fasting, yes, that other nations recognize), where there was a quote referring to our forefathers as Assyrian or Babylonian? Im sure youve seen that quote before, and it was in the 11-13th century timefram. [b] Also, which some may not like to hear but...before Jesus was tacked on to "Easter" (Ishtar) and "Christmas" those were Assyrian holidays that were always celebrated.

As far as the Juuuuuice people, what's good for Binyamin Yahudee is good for Edwar Sulaqa. Jesus spoke Aramaic, yet, still regarded as a Joowey. I don't see Muhammad Shamsadin Megalomattis or this Joseph guy making a strong case for present day Israe-lights/Juuuuuice to really be called "Arameans", which, they were very closely tied to. ( godfatha Abraham in the OT used to cruise up northeast to get some Aramean coochie)

If the entire region had switched over to Aramaic as it was the lingua franca, (that happened to be pushed forward by the Assyrians, lets not forget) then the only thing that would separate these people are the dialects or territorial difference. Today, there is no "HeebROOO" language, that is extinct, dead and buried with king Herod... yet that is what those Juiceee call their langauge. What they speak is THEIR version of Aramaic, with some YAHUDDEE influence. Assyrians also speak their version of Aramaic with some AKKADIAN influence. This is similar to the Arabic language and so called Arab peoples today. This is why there is no united Arab, one nation front. Heck, there's even dialiects within the country i.e. in Iraq with Baghdadli Arab and Maslawi Arab respectively. Even those turbanators realize that a Morrocan Arab is different than a Omani. So yeah, Assyrians in my opinion have the right to call their language Assyriac, or the Assyrian version of Aramaic. It is their language becase the adopted it and made it their own, on top of that, frm all indications, this was a political (empire reference) and voluntary move .

So I guess we have to remain consistent. If these so called "Assyrians" today cant call themselves that because they changed religions to Xtianity, then, who's religion does it belong to? And what about those JOOOS again? Since Jesus spoketh Aramaic, then does that make all Xtians Arameans? Nope. That's why you have Roman Catholic, russian catlhoic, CHALDEAN catholic, Assyrian COE, etc etc etcccc.

You've already pretty much established that language isn't what defines ethnicity. So what's left? You talk about passports. Well...I guess those Assyrians 'lobbying' (<being kind here) for a nation are striving for that "passport status"...Much like the Kurdis are...

Honestly I dont konw what the true motivation is by those who uplift the specific Assyrian name over the Chaldean one (who were, afterall, our last true dynasty), or Aramean that we are heavily influenced and mixed with, or even the MOTHER of Assyria, the Akkadians (<thats the name we should follow IMO, but I digress).... but I don't think its right for anyone (me or you, anyone) to piss on their lunch because Youkhana is striving for that Assyrian passport status too. We also have to be wary of selective history, since, nothing is concrete here. Completely siding with, say, Megalomatis or Joseph would make that person an extremist and very foolish, since they completely disregard anything Assyrian being linked to the northern mesopotamian peoples of today. Some of what they say has validity, and some of what the pro Assyrians say have validity. Its the middle ground people should come to and this is the only way a person will be completely comfortable about his/her supposed history.

the thing with those Assyrians REMAINING today in the middleast is, they dont want to abandon their language or religion (those abroad will give up that language eventually, as i hardly know my 'ALAP BEETS') and most feel they should rule over themselves. I've got no problem with that, more power to them if they want to achieve that but again I dont think its right to piss on whatever efforts (whining, crying) or progress, however little, they are making. Its also not right to blindly pick one side and disregard the other, especially when both have strong cases. This isn't the Chicago Bears vs the Indy Colts where you pick favorites, we are talking about history of a nation which many people have strong feelings about. ANYONE who completely disagrees with/denies Assyrians of today are being IRRESPONSIBLE and especially ignorant. There is enough "evidence" on Assyrian side of things for them to make that claim, even if it is not as strong as you or I think. Its not that far fetched to believe Aramaic speaking peoples with specific Akkadian influence are linked to the Assyrians.... and the whole isolated Xtian vs. Muslim thng, is what led to how many reasonably claim their community remained somewhat homogeneous.

the Assyrians arrived on the scene 1900 bc (going with the conservative figure here) and had power on and off until 612 BC. 1300 years of influence is NO FLUKE or 'johnny come lately' !!! the Arameans, who NEVER had the power the Assyrians did, arrived about 1200 BC, did just enough to influence language over the region. Those nomads then became civilized, and even held high positions AS ASSYRIANS. Assyrians absorbed them along with many others. Leading to my next and final thought:

I just want you and all to remember...that the term "ASSYRIAN" is much bigger than a simple name of an ethnic group...No sir, it was NATIONAL name, much like the powerful AMERICAN name is today. Just like blacks, orinetals, latinos, etc CAN ALL at the same time be "Americans", it was the same with Assyrians. So, there are remnamts of these people, who have yet to completely submit to the NEW major nation, "ARABS"... Now in your opinoin do you think they should just give in to AKMED and get it the fuck over with? OR, DO YOU BELIEVE THESE PEOPLE HAVE RIGHTS, AND LEGIT CLAIMS, to hang on to the MORE PROPER "Assyrian" name? Afterall, there was NO ONE BEFORE ASHUR who built Ashur, Nineveh, and Arbaelu, Dur Sharrukin, Khorsabad, etc. Whether our people today use this name as a political ploy or not, Im not sure, but I definitely lean towards believing the Assyrian cause and case for legitimacy. There are no people claiming to be fucking Gaulians, or Etruscans today, but there are Assyrian claims, and when I see some legit dots connected as history suggests...I have to agree that these people deserve to rule overthemselves with their FREEDOM, if they desire to do so....



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