The Inside Assyria Discussion Forum #5

=> Re: Mini you

Re: Mini you

Posted by MiniMe (Guest) - Tuesday, January 15 2008, 23:15:50 (CET) from 58.165.160.174 - CPE-58-165-160-174.nsw.bigpond.net.au Australia - Windows Codename Longhorn - Internet Explorer Website: Website title:

> >“That's a very strange way to be "proudAssyrians"; when you forget all about it.” > >It maybe strange, but it is natural. ...not at all. It's very unatural to forget suich a thing. It IS "natural" to think you can get some benefit from maiking this claim however...especially since you can't claim a country of your own for being Christians. * You can say what you like my friend. It doesn’t change any facts about human nature... Besides, who said anything about “claim a country?”... Do you see what you’re fixation is now? >“The larger point is that there are no direct descendants to the Assyrians today...” > >Anyone can make that claim today (it’s a free world we’re living in), and the agreement/disagreement in people (experts & non experts) will be divided... All part of life my friend... ...that the "pigs fly on Mars" thing again. When YOU make such an outrageous claim, it is not "a matter of opinion"...it's matter of the person standing Reason on its ehad explaining himself. You can't say, "I am a Rockefellar" and when asked for proof say "it's a matter of opinion". say "it's a matter of opinion"...no it's not. It's a matter of YOU claiming to be something. If you make the claim...you need to prove it. You can't say that since I can't prove pigs don't fly on Mars, it "proves your opinion" that they do. *Your exaggerated examples are the result of your “fixation” again. All I can say is, if pigs can run a forum on earth, why couldn’t they fly on mars? >“it's something Nestorians picked up on to get themselves a country...you know, like they were a "nation".” > >And who were those “Nestorians”? (Keep in mind that the laws of physics wouldn’t support the idea of “something” springing out from “nothing”). “...the Nestorians were all the people, Assyrians, Sumerians, Babylonians, Hittites, Hurrians, Amorites, Greeks, Persians and others who adopted Christianity and became citizens of the Parthian then Sasanian empires. In that melting pot people became Persian Christians....just as later they became Persian Muslims.” *Is there any DNA evidence of the “melting pot”?... And you ask others to prove their point?... Strange, but consistent with the fixation... >“...it isn't "dropping" now. It was "dropped" long ago. We have no way knowing what we are except Iraqi Christians and Persian Christians and Turkish Christians...just like there are English Christians and French Christians. >“Iraqi”??? you don’t like someone using “Assyrian” because westerners made it up, yet you use “Iraqi”??? “..it isn't aquestion of what "I Like". History doesn't revolve around me. I think Gaul is a much nicer name for France...but that's what it says on modern maps....I like Albion better than England...but that doesn't exist any longer..no matter what I feel about it. I'd look pretty stupid asking for a visa to Gaul today...because I "like that name better".” *Who’s asking for a visa to “Assyria”?... Stop being so desperate to prove everyone else wrong. The fact is, there are ordinary people, professional people, government people, scholars, academics, historians, anthropologists and other kind around the world, who “know” different things then you... Relax, enjoy your coffee and watch event unfold as they are... “...Iraq is the modern name of the country....big deal. If they change it to Atlanta tomorrow, I'll call it Atlanta. I'm not interested in names or symbols...this is ana ctualworld, not a virtual one.” *You’re the one living in a virtual word void of real natural human behaviour and experience... You only see what you “want” to see my friend, and you’re free to do so... Just know that the world doesn’t revolve around your views... Iraq is also a “new” label put there by those same “westerners”, don’t you know that? (we need a little consistency here, if you don’t mind). “...refer to the above. It doesn't matter to me what it's called...so long as I and the world are speaking the same language....I actuall want to see things get done...I'm not interested in recapturing past glories...or sipping mint juleps on a porch somewhere in the South.” We all like to see things get done... However, unless one deals with his past, the present and future will always be messy... Why do you think we’re in such a mess?... It’s because we havn’t dealt and cleared our past yet... And saying “we can’t be sure of who we are” isn’t a smart way of clearing the past, is it?... Just think without bias a little. >Besides, almost ALL the educated Iraqis claim to be descendants of the Ancient Sumerians/Assyrians/Babylonians. Maybe we should write a few posts to tell them how wrong they are and the world is laughing at them. “...none of them claim direct descent...and they also revere their Muslim Islamic descent as well...something we refuce to do. The great Islamic Empire is one they add to all their other influences...we deny it any validity.” *OH YES! Indirectly they do... Their problem of disassociating themselves from direct descent is the same as our problem...RELIGION! “...anyone from thatr region can claim to have some special feeling of oneness or atachment to the ancients...all of them, Muslims included. That isn't the issue...the issue is USING a claim of direcvt. lineal descent as an EXCLUCIVE basis for a demand of a new Assyria....that's absurd.” *absurd because you want it to be, not because it is... >“It's absurd to make such claims as we do...no one believes it and it will get us nothing but scorn....” > >It isn’t absurd at all, and many do believe it... Get us nothing but scorn? Yes, if a low class people hear that claim. “...you've got it backwards...the most staunch Assyrians are the least educated, most backward people you'll meet. they know what THEY believe is their history...but it isn't accepted in ANY legitimate history book or taught anywhere as a real thing...it's our own pop-history based on what WE say.” *That’s your conclusion, and you’re entitled to it. But it doesn’t make you right... If you say the majority in the world are like you? WELL! History proves that the majority is ALWAYS WRONG. SO, relax and watch the minority becoming the majority... >“...I'm saying it isn't "remembering" at all. It's "picking it up and applying it to yourself because you think you can gain some credibility from it". > >Again, it depends on the kind of people you’re dealing with... Why don’t you talk about the Kurds who are stealing the Assyrian history, just like others stole the Assyrian knowledge and claimed it their own... “...Kurds TOOK their lands...they have the same right America gave itself to take the lands of others and do anything it wanted with them. We too could EARN the same right...every nation "makes up history" to suit itself...I'm sure the Assyrians did the same thing. That isn't the point...the point is that our claims that justice needs to eb done to us because WE are the original Assyrians is foolishness personified...no one GAVE the Qurds what "they deserved"...they TOOK what they DESERVED...because those who take DESETRVE to have..if they can keep it...that's international law to this day. If we did that, power to us. But this begging and pleading whining and ridiculous "prooooves" that we think will get us something others KNOW how to get is embarrassing and enfeebling..it makes beggars of us all...look at us.” It’s human nature for the weak (who is good at heart) to appeal to the sympathy of the strong... Relax... Your fixation seems to be “Assyrian” and only Assyrian, and not facts related to anything else... ...huh? *You’re too occupied with “opposition to Assyrians” ONLY... Relax... According to your logic, isn’t the outcome already determined? If you really believed what you say (Assyrians won’t get anywhere because of their ridiculous claims)... Why frustrate yourself so much then? What are you afraid of? What are you trying to achieve? >“Go ahead....be anything you want.” > >I, you, and anyone else in the world can only be what we are... Find other people who have as many things in common with the Ancient Assyrians as we do, THEN you have something to argue about... until then, you are chasing a ghost. ...name ONE thing we have in common. ONE. *No need, because it won’t get you anywhere. You have made up your mind already, my friend... Just enjoy your life... > >40-50 years ago, a German Anthropologist asked to meet the head of the Assyrian community(Bishop) in Iraq to ask him a few questions. When he met the bishop, and after many questions related to language/tradition/customs and so on, the German asked the bishop what is the ritual Assyrians perform when a woman is delivering a baby. When the bishop told him, the German’s remarks was “you are true Assyrians, because only Assyrians do that”. (Of course, that isn’t done now by Assyrians who have lived in cities for long). ...sorry. That's merely anecdotal.. I have to see more of your evidence for this...and it still proves nothing...how the hell did he know that ONLY Assyrians did whatever it was? You see, it's just this kind of shoddy "proof" that we feed on....we're more than happy to accept ANYTHING that promises to make our claim stronger...but nowhere woould a real historian accept such word of mouth. *READ, READ, READ.................... With an open mind, though. >Also, Many years ago, the Jewish government decided to set up a group of professionals to search for lost words in their language, in the hope of , not only finding the true meaning to some of the words that have been lost, but also to preserve their language. One of those 12(?) professionals visited “Assyrians” in a particular country, in his search for the meaning of some of the Jewish words... Why do you think he did that? AND why do you think the Jewish “Sacred” language is called “Ashuri”? ....there are Arabic words and Persian words in our Aramaic...besides Aramaic wasn't the language of the Assyrians...Akkadian was. But again...I need to see exact sources. Dr Joseph has shown just how often our writers get things terribly wrong in what they think they've read. This sort of stuff needs to be picked over with a fine tooth comb..as any real scholar would. And we don't like doing that for obvious reasons. *One’s bias determines one’s conclusions, no matter who it is... Simple fact of human nature... I guess “Dr Joseph” would be a PhD holder on that (haven’t heard about him)... I’m not sure if you know that, before you are entitled for a PhD, your thesis should meet three requirements. Two of which are “ NEW knowledge, and BENEFIT to humanity”. Assuming Dr Joseph presented new knowledge, What benefit is there in his work for humanity? If there is any, what particular group? >Other things you said have the same basis, so I won’t repeat things over again (which you seem to love doing) > >“...and so is anyoen who tells you the Assyrians taught the Jews about a Messiah...or cannibalism and vampirism...these were never part of Assyrian beliefs or rituals and yet they are the core of Christianity....” > >The world changes. Unfortunately, in our case, it changed to the worst kind humanity has experienced since the creation of Rome’s Christianity... Inquisition, dark ages, world wars... remember those?... Aren’t we lucky the world survived? Soon, the world will breath easily, and more of the good things will come out about Assyrians... “...you neglected to answer the question...I said specifically that Messiah worship and cannibalism among a few others were NEVER part of Assyrian culture, ritual or beliefs....that was in response to your comment that Assyrian religion gave us Christianity etc...or Judaism, which is the same thing. I agree that things have "changed" since then...but they didn't change BEFORE the fact...before Assyrians supposedly turned Christian and made that "Assyrian"...the Assyrians never mentioned anywhere a Messiah...my conclusion was, that since the Messiah only appears among the Hebrews that it was threfore never a part of Assyrian culture...if it became so later, that's a different argument entirely...I KNOW it became part of our Christian culture...that wasn't the point...the point was that it was never a part of it we WERE Assyrians....Assyrians in everything that is.” *We said earlier it was a CORRUPTED version... ..if I repeat you apprently skip. > >Do you ever wonder why there is so much negative portrayed of Assyrians? The British museum has tones of Assyrian artefacts that brings them tones of money every year. Why isn’t “Assyrian” listed on their website alongside the Egyptian, Greek etc...? Go visit the site, explore, and take a tour... Come back and tell my why there is no Assyrian link shown there like all the others?(there are many similar questions related to other institutions, media, and so on ). You need to do some thinking my friend, but before you can do that, get rid of your fixation... “...take it easy with your superior tone. If YOU think there is something suspicious then YOU explain it. Why can you only ask questions? Do YOU think something is odd? Okay then, YOU explain it. Why do I have to go places and do it for you?” *Stay right where you are, it’s fine... >“the Assyrians had only what all religions and people have in common with Christianity; which is basic humanitarian practises and beliefs...” > >Fair enough. > >“the fine points of Christianity belong to the Jews....not the Assyrians.” > >Which points? Can you give us 3 examples please.. “...sure, the Messiah...you have to believe in him or you can't be a Christian....and you have to eat him and drink him or you can't get eternal life..which is what the whole thing is about...those are three....any comment? And DON'T ask me to go to the British Museum and read "odd things"....kay?” *True Christianity is NOT about “believing in a REMOTE Messiah”, it’s NOT about “eating him”, and it is NOT about “drinking him”.... You’re understanding of it is a perfect example of the CORRUPTED version I mentioned... Any comments on the RIGHT version? Maybe now you will search for it... Have a good day my firend... --------------------- - BACK TO INDEX - REPLY - QUOTE - EDIT - DELETE -

The full topic: Mini you pancho - Saturday, January 12 2008, 21:29:46 (CET) Re: Mini you AssyrianMuslim - 01/13 01:14 Re: Mini you pancho - 01/13 22:27 Re: Mini you MiniMe - 01/13 08:39 Re: Mini you pancho - 01/13 22:45 Re: Mini you MiniMe - 01/14 09:37 Re: Mini you pancho - 01/14 23:00 Re: Mini you MiniMe - 01/15 23:15 Re: Mini you pancho - 01/16 21:49

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