Re: Saul Alinsky

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Posted by Julia from dhcp102208.res-hall.northwestern.edu (199.74.102.208) on Wednesday, January 22, 2003 at 2:59AM :

In Reply to: Saul Alinsky posted by Julia from dhcp102208.res-hall.northwestern.edu (199.74.102.208) on Wednesday, January 22, 2003 at 2:50AM :

This begs the question:
what do you all think is the best way to change "the system" ? is it within the system or outside the system? a little of both? do we need more radicals, less liberals? i am being the liberal here by questioning all these things :) I always thought the best way to change things is from within. I feel like for my life, whatever changes i want to make is by in some ways being a part of the system, knowing how it works then applying pressure from within. If any of us have any social consciousness and a desire to improve the human condition...would it be best if we all tried to figure out how we as individuals can make the change, given whatever "talents" or "abilities" we have, or can we only really foment change radicalism? is any of this making sense?

: He wrote about the difference between
: liberals and radicals in "reveille for
: radicals." I (sadly) see myself in the liberal paradigm
: and i see fred in the radical paradigm...i'm
: not trying to characterize anyone (as i have done
: in the past) but i think Alinsky's observations
: are very , very, very, very accurate.

: "Liberals regard themselves as well informed and
: well balanced. They refer to radicals as "cranks". They, forget
: however, that the definition of a crank is
: an object that makes revolutions.

: "Liberals, in common with many conservatives,
: lay claim to the precious quality of
: impartiality, of cold objectivity, and to a sense of
: mystical impartial justice which enables
: them to view both sides of an issue. Since there are always
: at least two sides to every question and all
: justice on one side involves a certain degree
: of injustice to the other side, liberals
: are hesitant to act. Their opinions are studded
: with 'but on the other hand.' [that's me!!!!!!!]
: Caught on the horns of this dilemma they are
: paralyzed into immobility [this is me again :( ]
: they become utterly incapable of action. they
: discuss and discuss and end in disgust [this
: is totally parhadian writing. do you guys
: see this as well?]

: "Liberals charge radicals with passionate
: partisanship. To this accusation the radical's
: jaw tightens as he snaps, "guilty! we are
: all partisan for the people. Furthermore, we know that all
: people are partisan. The only nonpartisan
: people are those who are dead. You too are partisan -
: if not for the people, then for whom?" [this is
: absolutely fred's words right here..]

: "Liberals utter bold words at meetings: they strut,
: grimace belligerently, and then issue a
: weasel-worded statement "which has tremendous
: implications, if read between the lines." [this
: is me!! :( ] They endlessly pass resoulutions
: and endlessly do nothing. They sit calmly, dispassionately
: studying the issue; judging both sides; they sit and sit still.
: The radical does not sit frozen by cold
: objectivity. He sees injustice and strikes
: at it with hot passion. He is a man of decision
: and action. There is a saying that the difference
: between a liberal and a radical is that the liberal is
: one who walks out of the room when the argument
: turns into a fight.

: "Liberals protest;radicals rebel. Liberals
: become indignant, radicals become fighting
: mad and go into action. Liberals do not
: modify their personal lives and what they
: give to a cause is a small part of their
: lives; radicals give themselves to the cause.
: Liberals give and take oral arguments, radicals
: give and take the hard, dirty, bitter way
: of life. Liberals frequently achieve high
: places of respectability, ranging from the
: Supreme Court to the Congress; the names of
: radicals are rarely enscribed in marble
: but burn eternally in the hearts of man. Liberals
: have tener beliefs and are filled with
: repugnance at the grime, the sordidness,
: the pain, the persecution and the heartbreak
: of battle; radicals have tough convictions
: which are calloused by the rough road of
: direct action....Liberals dream dreams; radicals
: build the world of men's dreams."

-- Julia
-- signature .

Follow Ups:

Re: Saul Alinsky - Sadie 10:16AM 01/22/2003 () (3)

Re: Saul Alinsky - julia 2:39AM 01/23/2003 () (2)
- Re: Saul Alinsky - Sadie 1:02PM 01/23/2003 () (1)
  - corrections - in BOLD - Sadie 1:14PM 01/23/2003 () (0)

Re: Saul Alinsky - pancho 8:41AM 01/22/2003 () (0)

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Message:	: This begs the question: : what do you all think is the best way to change "the system" ? is it within the system or outside the system? a little of both? do we need more radicals, less liberals? i am being the liberal here by questioning all these things :) I always thought the best way to change things is from within. I feel like for my life, whatever changes i want to make is by in some ways being a part of the system, knowing how it works then applying pressure from within. If any of us have any social consciousness and a desire to improve the human condition...would it be best if we all tried to figure out how we as individuals can make the change, given whatever "talents" or "abilities" we have, or can we only really foment change radicalism? is any of this making sense? : : : He wrote about the difference between : : liberals and radicals in "reveille for : : radicals." I (sadly) see myself in the liberal paradigm : : and i see fred in the radical paradigm...i'm : : not trying to characterize anyone (as i have done : : in the past) but i think Alinsky's observations : : are very , very, very, very accurate. : : "Liberals regard themselves as well informed and : : well balanced. They refer to radicals as "cranks". They, forget : : however, that the definition of a crank is : : an object that makes revolutions. : : "Liberals, in common with many conservatives, : : lay claim to the precious quality of : : impartiality, of cold objectivity, and to a sense of : : mystical impartial justice which enables : : them to view both sides of an issue. Since there are always : : at least two sides to every question and all : : justice on one side involves a certain degree : : of injustice to the other side, liberals : : are hesitant to act. Their opinions are studded : : with 'but on the other hand.' [that's me!!!!!!!] : : Caught on the horns of this dilemma they are : : paralyzed into immobility [this is me again :( ] : : they become utterly incapable of action. they : : discuss and discuss and end in disgust [this : : is totally parhadian writing. do you guys : : see this as well?] : : "Liberals charge radicals with passionate : : partisanship. To this accusation the radical's : : jaw tightens as he snaps, "guilty! we are : : all partisan for the people. Furthermore, we know that all : : people are partisan. The only nonpartisan : : people are those who are dead. You too are partisan - : : if not for the people, then for whom?" [this is : : absolutely fred's words right here..] : : "Liberals utter bold words at meetings: they strut, : : grimace belligerently, and then issue a : : weasel-worded statement "which has tremendous : : implications, if read between the lines." [this : : is me!! :( ] They endlessly pass resoulutions : : and endlessly do nothing. They sit calmly, dispassionately : : studying the issue; judging both sides; they sit and sit still. : : The radical does not sit frozen by cold : : objectivity. He sees injustice and strikes : : at it with hot passion. He is a man of decision : : and action. There is a saying that the difference : : between a liberal and a radical is that the liberal is : : one who walks out of the room when the argument : : turns into a fight. : : "Liberals protest;radicals rebel. Liberals : : become indignant, radicals become fighting : : mad and go into action. Liberals do not : : modify their personal lives and what they : : give to a cause is a small part of their : : lives; radicals give themselves to the cause. : : Liberals give and take oral arguments, radicals : : give and take the hard, dirty, bitter way : : of life. Liberals frequently achieve high : : places of respectability, ranging from the : : Supreme Court to the Congress; the names of : : radicals are rarely enscribed in marble : : but burn eternally in the hearts of man. Liberals : : have tener beliefs and are filled with : : repugnance at the grime, the sordidness, : : the pain, the persecution and the heartbreak : : of battle; radicals have tough convictions : : which are calloused by the rough road of : : direct action....Liberals dream dreams; radicals : : build the world of men's dreams."

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